Form Module Dichotomy

Hello,

I wrote a complete backend in HTML::Widget a couple of
months ago, and
now I'm adding new functionallity to another part of the
site. The
question is:

a - Stick with HTML::Widget and wait for FormFu ?
b - use C::C::FormBuilder ?

I am inclined for option b, but would like some feedback
from others
before going down this path.

Thanks in advance for any comments.

Alejandro

_______________________________________________
List: Catalystlists.rawmode.org
Listinfo: ht
tp://lists.rawmode.org/mailman/listinfo/catalyst
Searchable archive: http://www.mail-
archive.com/catalystlists.rawmode.org/
Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.per
l.org/

Alejandro Imass wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I wrote a complete backend in HTML::Widget a couple of
months ago, and
> now I'm adding new functionallity to another part of
the site. The
> question is:
> 
> a - Stick with HTML::Widget and wait for FormFu ?
> b - use C::C::FormBuilder ?
> 
> I am inclined for option b, but would like some
feedback from others
> before going down this path.
> 
> Thanks in advance for any comments.
> 
> Alejandro

I'm in exactly the same bind and given everything I've seen
of FormFu, I'm 
definitely opting for (a).  Not to knock FormBuilder at all,
people seem to 
swear by it but I've not had time to explore it much.

To me it seems that Carl has really designed FormFu to be
"like" HTML::Widget 
but with many lessons learned.

Best,
Brian

_______________________________________________
List: Catalystlists.rawmode.org
Listinfo: ht
tp://lists.rawmode.org/mailman/listinfo/catalyst
Searchable archive: http://www.mail-
archive.com/catalystlists.rawmode.org/
Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.per
l.org/

Not long ago, Alejandro Imass proclaimed...
> I wrote a complete backend in HTML::Widget a couple of
months ago, and
> now I'm adding new functionallity to another part of
the site. The
> question is:
> 
> a - Stick with HTML::Widget and wait for FormFu ?
> b - use C::C::FormBuilder ?
> 
> I am inclined for option b, but would like some
feedback from others
> before going down this path.

I am currently developing my first app using C:C:FormBuilder
too, having
done previous Catalyst projects with HTML::Widget. I think
FormBuilder may
become the de facto way to develop Catalyst apps in the
future, especially
seeing there is a DBIx::Class::FormBuilder module on the
horizon that will
marry FormBuilder to DBIx::Class like
DBIx::Class::HTMLWidget does for
HTML::Widget.

Have I missed something? What's FormFu? 

-=Fozz

-- 
fozziodynamics.com is Doran L. Barton, president/CTO,
Iodynamics LLC
Iodynamics: IT and Web services by Linux/Open Source
specialists
 "I sick and stay in bed with a clod."
    -- Memo sent inside Japanese company in bond

_______________________________________________
List: Catalystlists.rawmode.org
Listinfo: ht
tp://lists.rawmode.org/mailman/listinfo/catalyst
Searchable archive: http://www.mail-
archive.com/catalystlists.rawmode.org/
Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.per
l.org/

FormFu is a soon to come alternative (replacement?) for
HTML::Widget

On 3/22/07, Doran L. Barton <fozziodynamics.com> wrote:
> Not long ago, Alejandro Imass proclaimed...
> > I wrote a complete backend in HTML::Widget a
couple of months ago, and
> > now I'm adding new functionallity to another part
of the site. The
> > question is:
> >
> > a - Stick with HTML::Widget and wait for FormFu ?
> > b - use C::C::FormBuilder ?
> >
> > I am inclined for option b, but would like some
feedback from others
> > before going down this path.
>
> I am currently developing my first app using
C:C:FormBuilder too, having
> done previous Catalyst projects with HTML::Widget. I
think FormBuilder may
> become the de facto way to develop Catalyst apps in the
future, especially
> seeing there is a DBIx::Class::FormBuilder module on
the horizon that will
> marry FormBuilder to DBIx::Class like
DBIx::Class::HTMLWidget does for
> HTML::Widget.
>
> Have I missed something? What's FormFu?
>
> -=Fozz
>
> --
> fozziodynamics.com is Doran L. Barton, president/CTO,
Iodynamics LLC
> Iodynamics: IT and Web services by Linux/Open Source
specialists
>  "I sick and stay in bed with a clod."
>     -- Memo sent inside Japanese company in bond
>
> _______________________________________________
> List: Catalystlists.rawmode.org
> Listinfo: ht
tp://lists.rawmode.org/mailman/listinfo/catalyst
> Searchable archive: http://www.mail-
archive.com/catalystlists.rawmode.org/
> Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.per
l.org/
>
>
>

_______________________________________________
List: Catalystlists.rawmode.org
Listinfo: ht
tp://lists.rawmode.org/mailman/listinfo/catalyst
Searchable archive: http://www.mail-
archive.com/catalystlists.rawmode.org/
Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.per
l.org/

Thank you all for the valuable input to this thread.

>From the comments, my conclusion is that if you already
developed with
HTML::Widget it would probably be better to stick with it
and wait for
FormFu (or use FormFu from svn), because it's more backward
compatible
with legacy HTML::Widget code. For new developments, both
FormFu and
FormBuilder seem to be valid options, and if you have
developed with
FormBuilder in the past it, would probably make sense to
use
C::C::FormBuilder. Nevertheless, FormFu seems to be a fresh,
KISS
powerful alternative to C::C::FormBuilder, and probably be
more
effective for Catalyst developers because it has been
thought to work
with Catalyst from the start. Just MHO and interpretation.

In my case, I will try both before deciding, and leave the
back-end
apps with HTML::Widget at the moment. I confess to be
inclined for
FormFu after Carl's comments because it seems that it would
be easier
to homologue the back-end apps to one standard in the near
future. On
the other hand, the little devil on left tells me that
CGI::FormBuilder is a very powerful and proven system that
would
certainly have advantages over FormFu in certain scenarios.
Again,
IMHO.

As to which one becomes the de-facto way, I will just say
one thing:
Hail TIMTOWTDI !

Best,
Alejandro

On 3/23/07, Carl Franks <fireartistgmail.com> wrote:
> On 22/03/07, Doran L. Barton <fozziodynamics.com> wrote:
> > I am currently developing my first app using
C:C:FormBuilder too, having
> > done previous Catalyst projects with HTML::Widget.
I think FormBuilder may
> > become the de facto way to develop Catalyst apps
in the future, especially
> > seeing there is a DBIx::Class::FormBuilder module
on the horizon that will
> > marry FormBuilder to DBIx::Class like
DBIx::Class::HTMLWidget does for
> > HTML::Widget.
>
> Well, if mts has anything to say about it, it'll be
Reaction that
> becomes the Cat de-facto ;)
>
> > Have I missed something? What's FormFu?
>
> Discussion of FormFu has generally been limited to the
html-widget
> mailing list so far.
> FormFu is similar to html-widget, but tries to get
everything right this time ;)
> It's main selling points are:
> * You can define your forms using external config files
(using any
> format supported by Config::Any)
> * Instead of having a simple idea of 'constraint' - it
has several
> stages that can process each form field.
> Filters -> Constraints -> Inflators ->
Validators -> Transformers.
> Filters are intended to do basic cleanup of data input,
such as
> removing trailing whitespace, or removing spaces in a
creditcard
> number.
> Constraints are low-level data validation, such as, is
this an
> integer, is this in bounds, etc.
> Inflators are similar to DBIC's - they expand the input
into an object
> of some sort, so there's one which creates a DateTime
object, and
> there's one which turns a file upload into an Imager
object.
> Validators are for 'business logic' - more complex
validation,
> possibly relating multiple fields, which will usually
require a custom
> class created for each check. The only validator
written as of yet is
> Imager::Size which checks a picture's pixel size is
within bounds.
> And Transformers are to manipulate the (possible
inflated) input data
> before using it. The ony transformer written so far is
Imager, to edit
> Imager objects (scale, crop, etc).
> There are also Deflators, so you can pass
$field->default($value) an
> object and make sure its value is printed properly.
> * Instead of using HTML::Element to generate the xhtml,
it uses TT
> templates. Every project will have it's own copy of the
template
> files, so you can customise them if you wish.
> * It's gotten rid of html-widget's seperate $result
object -
> simplifying usage greatly.
> * Integration with Catalst and DBIx::Class
>
> See `svn log` for more - there's lot's there!
> The code is currently available from:
> http://html-formfu.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/HTML-FormFu/

> http://html-formfu.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/DBIx-C
lass-FormFu/
> http://html-formfu.googlecode.com/sv
n/trunk/Catalyst-Controller-HTML-FormFu/
> http://html-formfu.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/HTML-Fo
rmFu-Dojo/
> http://html-formfu.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/HTML-
FormFu-Imager/
>
> I've started adding some TODO's to the issue tracker:
> http
://code.google.com/p/html-formfu/issues/list
> What would be most helpful though for anyone wishing to
help, would be
> documentation, as what's there is quite out-of-date.
>
> Cheers,
> Carl
>
> _______________________________________________
> List: Catalystlists.rawmode.org
> Listinfo: ht
tp://lists.rawmode.org/mailman/listinfo/catalyst
> Searchable archive: http://www.mail-
archive.com/catalystlists.rawmode.org/
> Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.per
l.org/
>

_______________________________________________
List: Catalystlists.rawmode.org
Listinfo: ht
tp://lists.rawmode.org/mailman/listinfo/catalyst
Searchable archive: http://www.mail-
archive.com/catalystlists.rawmode.org/
Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.per
l.org/

On 23/03/07, Alejandro Imass <alejandro.imassgmail.com> wrote:
> >From the comments, my conclusion is that if you
already developed with
> HTML::Widget it would probably be better to stick with
it and wait for
> FormFu (or use FormFu from svn), because it's more
backward compatible
> with legacy HTML::Widget code.

One last thing to keep in mind is though FormFu looks
similar to
html-widget, it isn't backwards compatible and html-widget
code would
definitely need syntax changes.

Cheers,
Carl

_______________________________________________
List: Catalystlists.rawmode.org
Listinfo: ht
tp://lists.rawmode.org/mailman/listinfo/catalyst
Searchable archive: http://www.mail-
archive.com/catalystlists.rawmode.org/
Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.per
l.org/