4.4 -> 5.0 upgrade (considerations)

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I'm working on a formula to enable a clean upgrade from 4.4
to 5.0.
Unfortunately, not only we have a big glibc upgrade on our
way, we
also have some nasty package fragmentation. The best
exemple
is xorg-x11-libs, which was separated in several (10+,
perhaps)
packages.

So far, I think the best plan is to create meta packages to
solve
this dependency hell. Lets call it
meta-4.4to5.0-upgrade.noarch.rpm.
This package should provide and requires the needed
components.

Unfortunatelly, this will probably change from system to
system,
which can become very nasty. In that case, we have two ways
to procede:

1) A script that will create a package specific for that
given
   system
2) Several meta packages

I'm kind of leaning toward the second option, with a super
meta
package that will require them all (in case someone want to
make things simples at the cost of installing extra
packages).

Comments ? Suggestions ?

- -- 
Rodrigo Barbosa
"Quid quid Latine dictum sit, altum viditur"
"Be excellent to each other ..." - Bill & Ted
(Wyld Stallyns)

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On 4/17/07, Rodrigo Barbosa <rodrigobdarkover.org> wrote:
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>
> I'm working on a formula to enable a clean upgrade from
4.4 to 5.0.
> Unfortunately, not only we have a big glibc upgrade on
our way, we
> also have some nasty package fragmentation. The best
exemple
> is xorg-x11-libs, which was separated in several (10+,
perhaps)
> packages.
>
> So far, I think the best plan is to create meta
packages to solve
> this dependency hell. Lets call it
meta-4.4to5.0-upgrade.noarch.rpm.
> This package should provide and requires the needed
components.
>
> Unfortunatelly, this will probably change from system
to system,
> which can become very nasty. In that case, we have two
ways to procede:
>
> 1) A script that will create a package specific for
that given
>    system
> 2) Several meta packages
>
> I'm kind of leaning toward the second option, with a
super meta
> package that will require them all (in case someone
want to
> make things simples at the cost of installing extra
packages).
>
> Comments ? Suggestions ?
>


Are you looking for something otehr than anaconda for small
memory or
something? I do not see live updates working for the faint
of heart
from 4.4 -> 5.0 .


-- 
Stephen J Smoogen. -- CSIRT/Linux System Administrator
How far that little candle throws his beams! So shines a
good deed
in a naughty world. = Shakespeare. "The Merchant of
Venice"
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On Tue, Apr 17, 2007 at 12:55:24PM -0600, Stephen John
Smoogen wrote:
> On 4/17/07, Rodrigo Barbosa <rodrigobdarkover.org> wrote:
> >I'm working on a formula to enable a clean upgrade
from 4.4 to 5.0.
> >Unfortunately, not only we have a big glibc upgrade
on our way, we
> >also have some nasty package fragmentation. The
best exemple
> >is xorg-x11-libs, which was separated in several
(10+, perhaps)
> >packages.
> >
> >So far, I think the best plan is to create meta
packages to solve
> >this dependency hell. Lets call it
meta-4.4to5.0-upgrade.noarch.rpm.
> >This package should provide and requires the needed
components.
> >
> >Unfortunatelly, this will probably change from
system to system,
> >which can become very nasty. In that case, we have
two ways to procede:
> >
> >1) A script that will create a package specific for
that given
> >   system
> >2) Several meta packages
> >
> >I'm kind of leaning toward the second option, with
a super meta
> >package that will require them all (in case someone
want to
> >make things simples at the cost of installing extra
packages).
> >
> >Comments ? Suggestions ?
> 
> Are you looking for something otehr than anaconda for
small memory or
> something? I do not see live updates working for the
faint of heart
> from 4.4 -> 5.0 .

Nah, mostly remote systems, hosted on datacenters or
somewhere else.

So far, the main problem I've encontered is really xorg. Go
figure.

[]s

- -- 
Rodrigo Barbosa
"Quid quid Latine dictum sit, altum viditur"
"Be excellent to each other ..." - Bill & Ted
(Wyld Stallyns)

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On Tue, Apr 17, 2007 at 12:16:50PM -0700, Scott Silva
wrote:
> Rodrigo Barbosa spake the following on 4/17/2007 12:00
PM:
> >>> I'm working on a formula to enable a clean
upgrade from 4.4 to 5.0.
> >>> Unfortunately, not only we have a big
glibc upgrade on our way, we
> >>> also have some nasty package
fragmentation. The best exemple
> >>> is xorg-x11-libs, which was separated in
several (10+, perhaps)
> >>> packages.
> >>>
> >>> So far, I think the best plan is to create
meta packages to solve
> >>> this dependency hell. Lets call it
meta-4.4to5.0-upgrade.noarch.rpm.
> >>> This package should provide and requires
the needed components.
> >>>
> >>> Unfortunatelly, this will probably change
from system to system,
> >>> which can become very nasty. In that case,
we have two ways to procede:
> >>>
> >>> 1) A script that will create a package
specific for that given
> >>>   system
> >>> 2) Several meta packages
> >>>
> >>> I'm kind of leaning toward the second
option, with a super meta
> >>> package that will require them all (in
case someone want to
> >>> make things simples at the cost of
installing extra packages).
> >>>
> >>> Comments ? Suggestions ?
> >> Are you looking for something otehr than
anaconda for small memory or
> >> something? I do not see live updates working
for the faint of heart
> >> from 4.4 -> 5.0 .
> > 
> > Nah, mostly remote systems, hosted on datacenters
or somewhere else.
> > 
> > So far, the main problem I've encontered is really
xorg. Go figure.
> You can do remote anaconda installs using vnc. I have
done it once or twice.
> Now if you could do remote ssh based text installs,
that would really rock!

Humm, that really doesn't cover my needs, since it would
need direct
interaction with the hardware (or something nasty to give
you an anaconda
boot).

[]s

- -- 
Rodrigo Barbosa
"Quid quid Latine dictum sit, altum viditur"
"Be excellent to each other ..." - Bill & Ted
(Wyld Stallyns)

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Alastair, there is no need to send a copy of your reply
directly to
me. Just to the list will do.

On Tue, Apr 17, 2007 at 05:56:50PM -0400, Alastair Neil
wrote:
>     Nah, mostly remote systems, hosted on datacenters
or somewhere else.
> 
>     So far, the main problem I've encontered is really
xorg. Go figure.
> 
> 
> If xorg is the major stumbling block on a remote server
why not simply do:
> yum remove xorg*
> before doing your upgrade?

Several things depend on xorg, including some stuff on the
base install.
I really wish it was as simple as that.

- -- 
Rodrigo Barbosa
"Quid quid Latine dictum sit, altum viditur"
"Be excellent to each other ..." - Bill & Ted
(Wyld Stallyns)

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Hi,

Rodrigo Barbosa wrote:
> 1) A script that will create a package specific for
that given
>    system
> 2) Several meta packages

A couple of scripts and process' have been proposed,
including one that 
Bill did on the wiki just the other day, perhaps you could
start there 
and maybe combine the efforts ? Bill has been putting in a
fair bit of 
effort into the upgrade process and is quite receptive to
most ideas.

There was another, longer and more involved route, posted to
the docs 
list - not sure if its on the wiki as yet.

> Comments ? Suggestions ?

just one comment - I'd really like to see a functional
process that can 
move most peoples platform from 4.4 to 5.0 

- KB
-- 
Karanbir Singh : http://www.karan.org/ :
2522219icq
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On Wed, Apr 18, 2007 at 01:28:38AM +0100, Karanbir Singh
wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Rodrigo Barbosa wrote:
> >1) A script that will create a package specific for
that given
> >   system
> >2) Several meta packages
> 
> A couple of scripts and process' have been proposed,
including one that 
> Bill did on the wiki just the other day, perhaps you
could start there 
> and maybe combine the efforts ? Bill has been putting
in a fair bit of 
> effort into the upgrade process and is quite receptive
to most ideas.
> 
> There was another, longer and more involved route,
posted to the docs 
> list - not sure if its on the wiki as yet.

Most processes I've seen so far on the lists here, although
funcional,
are very far from that I'm aiming at.

I want something clean, and 100% based on RPM (the script
I'm proposing
would only create a rpm package). In this case, it is better
to
start from scratch.

I'm not saying ther other method aren't good. They just are
not what I
want, and it is very easy for me to get on the wrong track
is I
base my efforts on theirs, as good as they are.

> >Comments ? Suggestions ?
> 
> just one comment - I'd really like to see a functional
process that can 
> move most peoples platform from 4.4 to 5.0 

As usual, time avaliability is my main problem. Thankfuly,
at this point,
I'm mostly running scripts and parsing results (gotta love
sed).

[]s

- -- 
Rodrigo Barbosa
"Quid quid Latine dictum sit, altum viditur"
"Be excellent to each other ..." - Bill & Ted
(Wyld Stallyns)

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Karanbir Singh wrote:
> There was another, longer and more involved route,
posted to the docs 
> list - not sure if its on the wiki as yet.

No, not yet. Completely forgot about that.

Ralph
-- 
Ralph Angenendt......rabr-online.de | .."Text processing has
made it possible
Bayerischer Rundfunk...80300 München | ....to right-justify
any idea, even one
Programmbereich.Bayern 3, Jugend und | .which cannot be
justified on any other
Multimedia.........Tl:089.5900.16023 |
..........grounds." -- J. Finnegan, USC

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