Re: DBmail webmail app

On Jun 7, 2007, at 6:41 PM, Michael Monnerie wrote:

> On Donnerstag, 7. Juni 2007 Tom Allison wrote:
>> If you want to make dbmail capable of doing spam
filtering...
>>  wouldn't it make more sense to simply pipe the
spam filtering in
>> front of the dbmail interface like procmail does
today?  I'm stuck on
>> this one.  I don't know where there is much
advantage here.
>
> It should never *do* spam filtering, but *support* it.
The idea is  
> this:
> - there are distributed checksums like DCC, pyzor,
razor

This makes sense, but how do you want to support it?

I think a lot of this falls under the responsibility of
sieve if it's  
to do anything prior to delivery.
After delivery, well you could troll through unread emails
using IMAP  
and move them to different folders accordingly.

I would think you could do a nice job filtering spam if you
had an  
LMTP based application that would just pipe the email from
the MTA  
(postfix) through it to your MDA (dbmail) and let sieve do
the final  
disposition (delete/directory).  But this isn't really a
dbmail  
extension.  More of a sieve extension if anything.
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On Thu, 2007-06-07 at 22:09 -0400, Tom Allison wrote:
> On Jun 7, 2007, at 6:41 PM, Michael Monnerie wrote:
> 
> > On Donnerstag, 7. Juni 2007 Tom Allison wrote:
> >> If you want to make dbmail capable of doing
spam filtering...
> >>  wouldn't it make more sense to simply pipe
the spam filtering in
> >> front of the dbmail interface like procmail
does today?  I'm stuck on
> >> this one.  I don't know where there is much
advantage here.
> >
> > It should never *do* spam filtering, but *support*
it. The idea is  
> > this:
> > - there are distributed checksums like DCC, pyzor,
razor
> 
> This makes sense, but how do you want to support it?
> 
> I think a lot of this falls under the responsibility of
sieve if it's  
> to do anything prior to delivery.
> After delivery, well you could troll through unread
emails using IMAP  
> and move them to different folders accordingly.
> 
> I would think you could do a nice job filtering spam if
you had an  
> LMTP based application that would just pipe the email
from the MTA  
> (postfix) through it to your MDA (dbmail) and let sieve
do the final  
> disposition (delete/directory).  But this isn't really
a dbmail  
> extension.  More of a sieve extension if anything.

All of this can be already with existing tools in exactly
the
configuration that you are suggesting, without any
extensions to
anything. Sieve header tests work with most X-Spam-Whatever
headers.

Aaron

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On Freitag, 8. Juni 2007 Tom Allison wrote:
> > - there are distributed checksums like DCC, pyzor,
razor
>
> This makes sense, but how do you want to support it?

If you'd store the checksum(s) of these projects within
searchable, 
indexable DB fields per each e-mail, you could make easy
spam checking 
yourself. Imagine every 30 minutes you recheck the last
received 
e-mails, and you find that 30% of them have the same DCC
checksum. 
There's a BIG chance that those messages are spam.

The point is it must be cheap (in terms of I/O and CPU) to
find out 
which e-mails you want to doublecheck, as you can't
reprocess all 
messages (at least not an ISP).

So there's not really a lot of support to implement in
dbmail. Just 
one/some fields per e-mail with checksum(s). A field
spam_score would 
also be good. But it'd be good to speak with developers of
SA, DCC and 
so on before, maybe they've got their own ideas already.

mfg zmi
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