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Thread: Issue 376: Proposed Resolution (Section 1)




Issue 376: Proposed Resolution (Section 1)
country flaguser name
United States
2007-02-25 17:41:43
In the next few messages, I will propose specific changes to
address Issue 
376.  This message will concentrate on changes to the
abstract and Section 
1.  Other messages will deal with other sections of the
document.

Abstract

   The so called network discovery and selection problem
affects network
   access, particularly in the presence of multiple
available wireless
   accesses and roaming.  This problem has been the subject
of
   discussions in various standards bodies.  This document
summarizes
   the discussion held about this problem in the Extensible
   Authentication Protocol (EAP) working group at the IETF. 
The problem
   is defined and divided into subproblems, and some
constraints for
   possible solutions are outlined.  The document also
provides a
   discussion of the limitations of certain classes of
solution,
   including some that have been previously defined.

Suggest changing to:

   When multiple access network are available, roaming
   users may have difficulty in selecting which network
   to connect to, and how to authenticate with that
network.
   This document defines the network discovery and
   selection problem, dividing it into multiple
sub-problems.
   Some constraints on potential solutions are outlined,
and
   the limitations of several solutions (including existing
ones)
   are discussed.

1. Introduction

   The network discovery and selection problem affects
network access
   and wireless access networks in particular.  Aspects of
the problem
   will appear when any of the following conditions are
true:

[BA] Suggest changing to:

   When multiple access network are available, roaming
   users may have difficulty in selecting which network
   to connect to, and how to authenticate with that
network.
   The problem arises when any of the following conditions
are
   true:

[BA] The next few paragraphs state conditions under which
the problem
can occur, but don't clearly state what bad things will
happen in
each circumstance:

   o  There is more than one available network attachment
point, and the
      different attachment points may have different
characteristics or
      belong to different operators.  In the case of virtual
operators,
      access network infrastructure including e.g. the
access points can
      be shared by multiple operators.  In order to choose
between the
      network attachment points, it may be helpful to
determine which
      realms are supported and the capabilities access
network
      supporting those realms.  Otherwise, the mobile
station might
      frequently roam into networks that are not able to
satisfy the
      roaming connectivity needs or provide services the
mobile station
      (and the subscriber) are seeking for.  This would of
course lower
      the general quality of offered services.

   o  The user has multiple sets of credentials.  For
instance, the user
      could have one set of credentials from a public
service provider
      and set from the user's employer.  In this case it may
be helpful
      to provide additional information to enable the
correct credential
      set to be determined.  Otherwise, it could happen that
for example
      a network access authentication repeatedly fails
because of
      incorrectly selected and offered set of credentials.

   o  There is more than one way to provide roaming between
the visited
      realm used for access and user's home realm, and
service
      parameters or pricing differs between them.  For
instance, the
      visited access realm could have both a direct
relationship with
      the home realm and an indirect relationship through a
roaming
      consortium.  In some scenarios, current AAA protocols
may not be
      able to route the requests to the home realm unaided,
just based
      on the domain in the given Network Access Identifier
(NAI)
      [RFC4282].  In addition, payload packets can get
routed or
      tunneled differently, based on the roaming
relationship path in
      use.  This may have an impact on the available
services or their
      pricing.

[BA] Suggest changing to:

   o  More than one network attachment point is available,
and the
      attachment points differ in capability or belong to
different
      operators.  In this case, a roaming user may have
difficulty
      determining which attachment points offering the
desired services
      it can successfully authenticate to.  In order to
choose between
      multiple attachment points, it can be helpful to
determine which
      realms are supported and the capabilities that the
networks support

   o  The user has multiple sets of credentials.  In this
case, the
      user may not be able to determine which credentials to
use with
      which attachment point, or even whether any
credentials it
      possesses will allow it to authenticate successfully. 
This
      can result in multiple unsuccessful authentication
attempts
      for each attachment point, wasting valuable time and
resulting
      in user frustration.   For example, the user
      could have one set of credentials from a public
service provider
      and set from an employer.  In order to choose between
multiple
      attachment points, it can be helpful to provide
additional
      information to enable the correct credentials to be
determined.

   o  There are multiple potential roaming paths between the
visited
      realm and the user's home realm, and service
parameters or
      pricing differs between them.  In this case, the
access network
      may not be able to determine the roaming path that
best matches
      the user's preferences.  This can lead to the user
being
      charged more than necessary, or not obtaining the
desired
      services.  For example, the visited access realm could
have
      both a direct relationship with the home realm and an
indirect
      relationship through a roaming consortium.  Current
AAA protocols
      may not be able to route the access request to the
home AAA sever
      purely based on the realm within the Network Access
Identifier (NAI)
      [RFC4282].  In addition, payload packets can be routed
or
      tunneled differently, based on the roaming
relationship path.
      This may have an impact on the available services or
their
      pricing.

[BA] The next paragraph could be cleaned up a bit:

   In Section 2 the network discovery and selection problem
is defined
   and divided into subproblems, and some design issues for
possible
   solutions are outlined in Section 3.  Section 4 gives the
conclusions
   and some suggestions on how to proceed for the rest. 
Appendix A
   discusses existing mechanisms which help solve at least
parts of the
   problem.  The terms "network" and
"realm" have sometimes been used
   interchangeably within the context of selection and
discovery.  It
   should be noted that a realm can be reachable from more
than one
   access network types and selection of a realm may not
imply certain
   network capabilities.

Suggest changing to:

   In Section 2 the network discovery and selection problem
is defined
   and divided into subproblems, and some potential solution
constraints
   are outlined in Section 3.  Section 4 provides
conclusions
   and suggestions for future work.  Appendix A
   discusses existing solutions to portions of the problem.

[BA] The following sentences belong in the terminology
section:

   The terms "network" and "realm" have
sometimes been used
   interchangeably within the context of selection and
discovery.  It
   should be noted that a realm can be reachable from more
than one
   access network types and selection of a realm may not
imply certain
   network capabilities.


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Re: Issue 376: Proposed Resolution (Section 1.1)
country flaguser name
United States
2007-02-26 08:15:08
   Decorated NAI

      A NAI specifying a source route.  See RFC4282
[RFC4282] Section
      2.7 for more information.

[BA] "RFC4282" -> "RFC 4282"

   Realm

      Realm portion of an NAI [RFC4282].

[BA] Change to "The realm portion of..."

   Network Selection

      This refers to selection of an operator/ISP in order
to access the
      network.  The process of network selection can occur
either at the
      beginning of a new session or during a handoff in case
the user is
      mobile.  The selection is dependent upon for example
the selection
      of realm for the operator, authentication credentials
for the
      user/device and the roaming agreements.  The realm
Selection can
      in turn also depend upon Access Technology Selection
and/or Bearer
      Selection.

[BA] I don't understand how network selection can occur at
the beginning
of a session -- doesn't it need to occur before the session
begins?
Also, I don't understand how network selection can occur
during an L2
handoff.  The "realm" of an operator doesn't make
sense -- isn't a
realm is a characteristic of the home AAA server? Suggest
rewriting to:

      Selection of an operator/ISP for network access. 
Network Selection
      occurs prior to network access authentication.

   Network Discovery

      This refers to a mechanisms that a node uses to
discover available
      networks prior the realm selection takes place.  The
discovery
      process may be passive or active from a node point of
view.
      Typically the discovery mechanism varies depending on
the access
      technology.  It is also possible that there are
multiple discovery
      mechanisms within one access technology depending on
the network
      deployment.

[BA] Suggest rewriting to:

      The mechanism used to discover available networks. The
discovery
      mechanism may be passive or active, and depends on the
access
      technology.  In passive network discovery, the node
listens for
      network announcements; in active network discovery the
node
      solicits network announcements.  It is possible for an
access
      technology to utilize both passive and active network
discovery
      mechanisms.

   Realm Selection

      This refers to selection of the realm of the
operator/ISP used to
      access the network.

[BA] This doesn't make sense to me -- the realm is a
characteristic of
the home AAA server.  Suggest rewriting to:

The selection of the realm (and corresponding NAI) used to
access the
network.

   Network Access Server

      The Network Access Server (NAS) is the device that
clients connect
      to in order to get access to the network.  In PPTP
terminology,
      this is referred to as the PPTP Access Concentrator
(PAC), and in
      L2TP terminology, it is referred to as the L2TP
Access
      Concentrator (LAC).  In IEEE 802.11, it is referred to
as an
      Access Point.

[BA] I would change to:

   Network Access Server

      The device that peers connect to in order to obtain
access to the
      network.  In PPTP terminology,
      this is referred to as the PPTP Access Concentrator
(PAC), and in
      L2TP terminology, it is referred to as the L2TP
Access
      Concentrator (LAC).  In IEEE 802.11, it is referred to
as an
      Access Point.


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Re: Issue 376: Proposed Resolution (Section 2)
country flaguser name
United States
2007-02-26 08:26:46
Section 2

   This problem spans multiple protocol layers and has been
the subject
   of discussions in IETF, 3GPP, and IEEE.  This document
summarizes the
   discussion held about this problem in the Extensible
Authentication
   Protocol working group at IETF.  There are a set of
somewhat
   orthogonal problems being discussed under the rubric of
"network
   discovery and selection".

[BA]  Suggest changing to:

The network discovery and selection problem can be broken
down into
multiple sub-problems.  These include:


   o  The problem of "discovery of points of
attachment".  This is the
      problem of discovering points of attachment available
in the
      vicinity, and the capabilities associated with these
points of
      attachment.

   o  The problem of "Identifier selection".  This
is the problem of
      selecting which identity (and credentials) to use to
authenticate
      in a given point of attachment to the network.

   o  The problem of "AAA routing" which involves
figuring out how to
      route the authentication conversation originating from
the
      selected identity back to the home realm.

   o  The problem of "Payload routing" which
involves figuring how the
      payload packets are routed, where more advanced
mechanisms than
      destination-based routing is needed.  However, while
being an
      interesting problem, this document does not attempt to
do any
      analysis or suggestions on it.

[BA] Suggest changing to:

o Discovery of points of attachment.  This involves the
discovery
of points of attachment in the vicinity, as well as their
capabilities.

o  Identifier selection.  This involves selection of the
NAI (and credentials) used to authenticate to the selected
ponit of attachment.

o  AAA routing. This involves routing of the AAA
conversation back to the home AAA server, based on the
realm
of the selected NAI.

o  Payload routing.  This involves the routing of data
packets, in
the situation wh ere mechanisms more advanced than
destination-based
routing are required.  While this problem is interesting, it
is not
discussed further in this document.


   o  The problem of "network capability
discovery".  This is the
      problem of discovering the capabilities of a
particular
      destination network.  For example, it may be important
to know
      whether a given network supports enrollment, what the
charges are,
      etc.

[BA] I'm not sure what "network capability
discovery" means.  Is this
about discovery the capabilities of the access network, or
of the
home realm?  On the assumption that this is about the home
realm,
I suggest that the text be changed to the following:

o Realm capability discovery.  This involves discovering
the
capabilities of a home AAA server, such as whether the
home AAA server supports enrollment.


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Re: Issue 376: Proposed Resolution (Section 1)
user name
2007-02-26 16:51:43
Hi Bernard,

I would propose to replace the term "roaming user"
with "user" in you
proposed changes as this problem can exist even when the
user is not
roaming e.g. when multiple networks with different
capabilities exist
with user's home operator at a geographic location. Is that
change
acceptable?

BR,
 
Farooq Bari
farooq.bariatt.com
+1 425 580 5526
 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bernard Aboba [mailto:bernard_abobahotmail.com]
> Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2007 3:42 PM
> To: eapfrascone.com
> Subject: [eap] Issue 376: Proposed Resolution (Section
1)
> 
> In the next few messages, I will propose specific
changes to address
Issue
> 376.  This message will concentrate on changes to the
abstract and
Section
> 1.  Other messages will deal with other sections of the
document.
> 
> Abstract
> 
>    The so called network discovery and selection
problem affects
network
>    access, particularly in the presence of multiple
available wireless
>    accesses and roaming.  This problem has been the
subject of
>    discussions in various standards bodies.  This
document summarizes
>    the discussion held about this problem in the
Extensible
>    Authentication Protocol (EAP) working group at the
IETF.  The
problem
>    is defined and divided into subproblems, and some
constraints for
>    possible solutions are outlined.  The document also
provides a
>    discussion of the limitations of certain classes of
solution,
>    including some that have been previously defined.
> 
> Suggest changing to:
> 
>    When multiple access network are available, roaming
>    users may have difficulty in selecting which
network
>    to connect to, and how to authenticate with that
network.
>    This document defines the network discovery and
>    selection problem, dividing it into multiple
sub-problems.
>    Some constraints on potential solutions are
outlined, and
>    the limitations of several solutions (including
existing ones)
>    are discussed.
> 
> 1. Introduction
> 
>    The network discovery and selection problem affects
network access
>    and wireless access networks in particular.  Aspects
of the problem
>    will appear when any of the following conditions are
true:
> 
> [BA] Suggest changing to:
> 
>    When multiple access network are available, roaming
>    users may have difficulty in selecting which
network
>    to connect to, and how to authenticate with that
network.
>    The problem arises when any of the following
conditions are
>    true:
> 
> [BA] The next few paragraphs state conditions under
which the problem
> can occur, but don't clearly state what bad things will
happen in
> each circumstance:
> 
>    o  There is more than one available network
attachment point, and
the
>       different attachment points may have different
characteristics
or
>       belong to different operators.  In the case of
virtual
operators,
>       access network infrastructure including e.g. the
access points
can
>       be shared by multiple operators.  In order to
choose between the
>       network attachment points, it may be helpful to
determine which
>       realms are supported and the capabilities access
network
>       supporting those realms.  Otherwise, the mobile
station might
>       frequently roam into networks that are not able
to satisfy the
>       roaming connectivity needs or provide services
the mobile
station
>       (and the subscriber) are seeking for.  This would
of course
lower
>       the general quality of offered services.
> 
>    o  The user has multiple sets of credentials.  For
instance, the
user
>       could have one set of credentials from a public
service provider
>       and set from the user's employer.  In this case
it may be
helpful
>       to provide additional information to enable the
correct
credential
>       set to be determined.  Otherwise, it could happen
that for
example
>       a network access authentication repeatedly fails
because of
>       incorrectly selected and offered set of
credentials.
> 
>    o  There is more than one way to provide roaming
between the
visited
>       realm used for access and user's home realm, and
service
>       parameters or pricing differs between them.  For
instance, the
>       visited access realm could have both a direct
relationship with
>       the home realm and an indirect relationship
through a roaming
>       consortium.  In some scenarios, current AAA
protocols may not be
>       able to route the requests to the home realm
unaided, just based
>       on the domain in the given Network Access
Identifier (NAI)
>       [RFC4282].  In addition, payload packets can get
routed or
>       tunneled differently, based on the roaming
relationship path in
>       use.  This may have an impact on the available
services or their
>       pricing.
> 
> [BA] Suggest changing to:
> 
>    o  More than one network attachment point is
available, and the
>       attachment points differ in capability or belong
to different
>       operators.  In this case, a roaming user may have
difficulty
>       determining which attachment points offering the
desired
services
>       it can successfully authenticate to.  In order to
choose between
>       multiple attachment points, it can be helpful to
determine which
>       realms are supported and the capabilities that
the networks
support
> 
>    o  The user has multiple sets of credentials.  In
this case, the
>       user may not be able to determine which
credentials to use with
>       which attachment point, or even whether any
credentials it
>       possesses will allow it to authenticate
successfully.  This
>       can result in multiple unsuccessful
authentication attempts
>       for each attachment point, wasting valuable time
and resulting
>       in user frustration.   For example, the user
>       could have one set of credentials from a public
service provider
>       and set from an employer.  In order to choose
between multiple
>       attachment points, it can be helpful to provide
additional
>       information to enable the correct credentials to
be determined.
> 
>    o  There are multiple potential roaming paths
between the visited
>       realm and the user's home realm, and service
parameters or
>       pricing differs between them.  In this case, the
access network
>       may not be able to determine the roaming path
that best matches
>       the user's preferences.  This can lead to the
user being
>       charged more than necessary, or not obtaining the
desired
>       services.  For example, the visited access realm
could have
>       both a direct relationship with the home realm
and an indirect
>       relationship through a roaming consortium. 
Current AAA
protocols
>       may not be able to route the access request to
the home AAA
sever
>       purely based on the realm within the Network
Access Identifier
(NAI)
>       [RFC4282].  In addition, payload packets can be
routed or
>       tunneled differently, based on the roaming
relationship path.
>       This may have an impact on the available services
or their
>       pricing.
> 
> [BA] The next paragraph could be cleaned up a bit:
> 
>    In Section 2 the network discovery and selection
problem is defined
>    and divided into subproblems, and some design issues
for possible
>    solutions are outlined in Section 3.  Section 4
gives the
conclusions
>    and some suggestions on how to proceed for the rest.
 Appendix A
>    discusses existing mechanisms which help solve at
least parts of
the
>    problem.  The terms "network" and
"realm" have sometimes been used
>    interchangeably within the context of selection and
discovery.  It
>    should be noted that a realm can be reachable from
more than one
>    access network types and selection of a realm may
not imply certain
>    network capabilities.
> 
> Suggest changing to:
> 
>    In Section 2 the network discovery and selection
problem is defined
>    and divided into subproblems, and some potential
solution
constraints
>    are outlined in Section 3.  Section 4 provides
conclusions
>    and suggestions for future work.  Appendix A
>    discusses existing solutions to portions of the
problem.
> 
> [BA] The following sentences belong in the terminology
section:
> 
>    The terms "network" and "realm"
have sometimes been used
>    interchangeably within the context of selection and
discovery.  It
>    should be noted that a realm can be reachable from
more than one
>    access network types and selection of a realm may
not imply certain
>    network capabilities.
> 
> 
>
____________________________________________________________
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> To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options,
please visit:
> http:/
/lists.frascone.com/mailman/listinfo/eap
> 
> Arhives: http://lists.
frascone.com/pipermail/eap
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