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Thread: An example of a bad biography
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| An example of a bad biography |

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2008-04-29 10:36:40 |
1. None of the offending ip numbers was blocked, ever.
2. RyRy5, not really intentionally as far as I can tell,
restored the
worst version after an anon had cleaned it up!
3. East718 did the right thing and semi-protected... but
only on April
26th, many days after the vandalism spree had died down
The article has never, even once, contained any useful
information about
the victim. It has always been a stub. A quick look around
the web
suggests that it will never be more than a stub.
(Of the top 10 hits in google, more are about his wikipedia
entry than
anything else!)
All of the following is still in the article history, where
it might be
read by Mr. Kinnear's children, his mother, future
employers, etc.
I propose that policies still need a lot of work to get us
to where we
need to be on BLP.
Please read all of the following, and ask whether it
reflects the values
we all hold for our project.
===============
08:35, 6 September 2006 - ''Bob Kinnear''' is a douchebag in
[[Toronto]], [[Ontario]], [[Canada]]. He is the leader of
the
[[Amalgamated Transit Union]], Local 113.
11:51, 27 March 2008 - In September 2007, a report released
to the
public stated that Kinnear is developmentally delayed. He is
an active
supporter and volunteer of the guns for toys program in
Toronto.
11:51, 27 March 2008 - In September 2007, a report released
to the
public stated that Kinnear is developmentally delayed. He is
an active
supporter and volunteer of the Guns for Toys program in
Toronto.
13:32, 10 April 2008 - Heavy marijuana user.
16:11, 10 April 2008 - He is a heavy marijuana smoker
16:16, 10 April 2008 - nickname = Iron
Mike<br/>Baddest Man on the
Planet<br/>Kid Dynamite
11:17, 17 April 2008 - '''Bob Kinnear''' is a douchebag.
12:32, 17 April 2008 - Mr. Kinnear believes that striking
and screwing
over the City is the best possible way to line his workers
pockets with
more money. In a recent study, over 25% of TTC riders
believe that Bob
Kinnear is a supreme douchebag.
15:21, 17 April 2008 - He (here on referred to as "a
giant piece of
shit") has made a scapegoat of himself by directing the
workers of the
[[Toronto Transit Commission]] to strike on [[April 21]]st,
2008 at 4:00
a.m., leaving at least one million commuters who rely on the
TTC to fend
for themselves.
15:22, 17 April 2008 - BOB KINNEAR IS A FUCKING RETARD.
15:23, 17 April 2008 - BOB KINNEAR EATS SHIT.
16:51, 17 April 2008 - '''Bob Kinnear''' is a labour leader
and pirate
in [[Toronto]], [[Ontario]], [[Canada]]. He is the leader of
the
[[Amalgamated Transit Union]], Local 113.
20:34, 17 April 2008 - Bob Kinnear is a Class A cock-smoker
with a
terrible set of plugs. Born in a trailer park, the bastard
son of a
dirty Carney and his retarded cousin, Bob grew up to be the
colossal
piece of shit that likes to shut the city down every two
years so he can
whine. Whine about how his $25+ dollar an hour plus benefit
bus/streetcar drivers, some of the RUDEST, surliest people
on earth,
don't get paid enough.
+
+
Whine about how when every once in a while, one of these
pricks lips off
to the wrong person and gets slapped around for it. Yeah
it's the city
and there are SOME crazy/shitty /violent people, and
unprovoked
incidents DO happen. Welcome to the big city genius. Bob
should spent a
day incogneto on the system and find out EXACTLY how these
people treat
riders. It ain't pretty. I'm sure they're all sunshine and
lollypops
when they know the Boss or the Media is watching. Bob's in
for a rude
shock when the Union's forced back to work by Monday night
then deemed
an essential service by the Province.
+
+
Toronto is FED UP. The public is NOT behind you in any way,
shape or
form. We all knew that you would not be giving 48 hours
notice of a
strike because you knew it would be like shoving drivers
through a meat
grinder for 48 hours. I mean really, Bob. Did you REALLY
think we'd
believe that you would put the employees out the with the
pissed off
public that you're fucking over? Coward. Typical Union. Now
we get to
wake Monday morning before we know for sure. Congrats Bob,
you're in for
a rude shock when the Union's forced back to work by Monday
night then
deemed an essential service by the Province probably not
long
thereafter. (Hint: expect it to be an election issue, which
means you
are fucked.) Maybe if you end up getting a few days off, you
could go
fix that hair of yours. Is that what all this is about Bob?
Money to get
the rest of the plugs done? You're a dickhead Bob. You sound
like a
whiny jerk who just loves to have his little media moments.
Kind of like
that Craig Brommel idiot from the police union. The TTC WILL
end up an
essential service after this stunt sport, and when it is you
and all
those lazy, rude, jackasses you call employees can go pound
sand up your
collective asses if you don't like what you're offered or
don't let the
door hit you on the ass on the way out.
+
+
Remember dummy, the public isn't going to be real inclined
to be kind to
TTC employees after spending a few days rotting in traffic
or walking
for miles/hours every day. Don't whine when there's a
backlash. You
unions are masters of cutting your own throats when it comes
to public
support. It boggles the mind.
+
Worth a Million? More like WORTHLESS.
20:40, 17 April 2008 - ''Bob Kinnear''' eats babies in
[[Toronto]],
[[Ontario]], [[Canada]]. He is deathly afraid of Chuck
Norris and is in
charge of reach-arounds at the [[Amalgamated Transit
Union]], Local 113.
02:40, 20 April 2008 - '''Bob Kinnear''' is a self serving
jack-off in
[[Toronto]], [[Ontario]], [[Canada]]. He is the leader of
the
[[Amalgamated Asshole's Union]], Local 113.
02:44, 20 April 2008 - '''Bob Kinnear''' is a self serving
jack-off in
[[Toronto]], [[Ontario]], [[Canada]]. He is the leader of
the
[[Amalgamated Asshole's Union]], Local 113.
17:06, 20 April 2008 - Kinnear's attempt at organizing a
system-wide TTC
strike in April 2008, which would affect some 1.5 million
daily
commuters, was averted nearly two hours past the
self-imposed deadline
of 4 p.m. on April 20. I guess a whole bunch of fat, lazy,
overpaid,
underworked, unionized bastards will have to be cancelling
their
vacation plans.
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| Re: An example of a bad biography |
  United Kingdom |
2008-04-29 10:53:56 |
Hmm. Ok, deleted and recreated with the good version to
remove the history. Semi-protection and move-full-protection
of infinite duration. Did I miss anything?
It may be better to merge his article in with that of the
union he's head of. There don't appear to be all that many
sources out there we could use to help us build a better
article, but I don't pretend to have looked to closely. He
is head of a decent-sized (?) union, after all. We'll see.
Oh, and Jimbo, I hope you've noticed you might be appointing
a new arbitrator pretty soon. How much of our time has that
poisonous piece of slime, Daniel Brandt, wasted? God damn
him.
CM
Odi profanum vulgus et arceo.
> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 11:36:40 -0400
> From: jwales wikia.com
> To: wikien-l lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: [WikiEN-l] An example of a bad biography
>
> 1. None of the offending ip numbers was blocked, ever.
> 2. RyRy5, not really intentionally as far as I can
tell, restored the
> worst version after an anon had cleaned it up!
> 3. East718 did the right thing and semi-protected...
but only on April
> 26th, many days after the vandalism spree had died
down
>
> The article has never, even once, contained any useful
information about
> the victim. It has always been a stub. A quick look
around the web
> suggests that it will never be more than a stub.
>
> (Of the top 10 hits in google, more are about his
wikipedia entry than
> anything else!)
>
> All of the following is still in the article history,
where it might be
> read by Mr. Kinnear's children, his mother, future
employers, etc.
>
> I propose that policies still need a lot of work to get
us to where we
> need to be on BLP.
>
> Please read all of the following, and ask whether it
reflects the values
> we all hold for our project.
____________________________________________________________
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| Re: An example of a bad biography |
  United States |
2008-04-29 10:55:20 |
Moreschi has done the right thing by recreating it (losing
all
the muckraking old history) as a permanently semi-protected
stub,
noting that it's likely to be a magnet for BLP violations.
A question just occurred to me: given that we know it's a
magnet,
do we really want to say "You can help Wikipedia by
expanding
it", with an extra, handy link to the edit button?
Seems to me
we'd really rather that many of these BLP stubs *stay*
stubs.
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| Re: An example of a bad biography |
  United Kingdom |
2008-04-29 10:58:47 |
Not really. If an article's always going to be a stub,
there's no point having it all. Then it's a case for
redirection and merging. Really, if we can't write an FA on
a certain subject, the article is dubious: if we can't
manage to write an article of DYK-acceptable length it's
really dodgy. One of my notability tests, anyway
CM
Odi profanum vulgus et arceo.
> From: scs eskimo.com
> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 11:55:20 -0400
> To: wikien-l lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] An example of a bad biography
>
> Moreschi has done the right thing by recreating it
(losing all
> the muckraking old history) as a permanently
semi-protected stub,
> noting that it's likely to be a magnet for BLP
violations.
>
> A question just occurred to me: given that we know it's
a magnet,
> do we really want to say "You can help Wikipedia
by expanding
> it", with an extra, handy link to the edit button?
Seems to me
> we'd really rather that many of these BLP stubs *stay*
stubs.
>
> _______________________________________________
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> WikiEN-l lists.wikimedia.org
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> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
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| Re: An example of a bad biography |

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2008-04-29 10:59:19 |
That's not a bad biography, it's childish vandalism that
happened to
be missed. Stable versions should help with that in the not
too
distant future. I don't really see how such articles harm
the subject
- they're obviously vandalised and any reasonable reader
will
disregard them (perhaps we should try and cater to
unreasonable
readers, but I'm not sure we realistically can).
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| Re: An example of a bad biography |
  United States |
2008-04-29 11:05:23 |
Jimmy Wales wrote:
> The article has never, even once, contained any useful
information about
> the victim. It has always been a stub. A quick look
around the web
> suggests that it will never be more than a stub.
>
I'm not sure what you intend to prove with this straw-man.
You found one
article that has been on Wikipedia for nine days, that
should have been
deleted, but hasn't been. Nobody's even objected to its
deletion!
Considering we have over 2 million articles, this is
unsurprising.
-Mark
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| Re: An example of a bad biography |

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2008-04-29 11:10:52 |
On 29/04/2008, Thomas Dalton <thomas.dalton gmail.com> wrote:
>
> That's not a bad biography, it's childish vandalism
that happened to
> be missed. Stable versions should help with that in the
not too
> distant future. I don't really see how such articles
harm the subject
> - they're obviously vandalised and any reasonable
reader will
> disregard them (perhaps we should try and cater to
unreasonable
> readers, but I'm not sure we realistically can).
No, it's a bad biography. It's exactly the type of
biography we don't need.
This guy is president of a single local of a union. That is
the only thing
that makes him the least bit notable; and his name is only
in the news right
now because his local is in labour negotiations. This time
next month,
nobody will be interested in him -except of course for the
same people who
have been trashing him thus far.
These biographies of people with very marginal notability
are magnets for
vandalism. It's a waste of good editor time to expect people
to monitor them
and clean up vandalism in them; yet, failing to actively
monitor them (or
messing up when we actually do look at them) leads to the
article Jimmy
mentions at the beginning.
Risker
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| Re: An example of a bad biography |

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2008-04-29 11:24:10 |
2008/4/29 Christiano Moreschi <moreschiwikiman hotmail.co.uk>:
>
> Not really. If an article's always going to be a stub,
there's no point having it all.
I disagree that a BLP is ever "always" going to be
a stub - in this
specific case, many union leaders go into politics; at the
least, he
may turn into another [[Bob Crow]].
Our inability to predict the future extends to other
categories of
article, too. For instance, before 1st August 2007, many
might have
said that [[I-35W Mississippi River bridge]] was
"always going to be a
stub". Having it existing as a stub probably helped
editors build it
up when it became somewhat more notable than it previously
had been.
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| Re: An example of a bad biography |

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2008-04-29 11:30:38 |
2008/4/29 James Farrar <james.farrar gmail.com>:
> 2008/4/29 Christiano Moreschi <moreschiwikiman hotmail.co.uk>:
> > Not really. If an article's always going to be a
stub, there's no point having it all.
> I disagree that a BLP is ever "always" going
to be a stub - in this
> specific case, many union leaders go into politics; at
the least, he
> may turn into another [[Bob Crow]].
Bob Crow was the example I was about to mention too
- d.
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| Re: An example of a bad biography |
  United Kingdom |
2008-04-29 11:33:50 |
Ah, fair point. I hadn't thought of that one. Apply an
opt-out policy to said stubs, in which case (but not to
other BLPs)?
CM
Odi profanum vulgus et arceo.
> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 17:24:10 +0100
> From: james.farrar gmail.com
> To: wikien-l lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] An example of a bad biography
>
> 2008/4/29 Christiano Moreschi <moreschiwikiman hotmail.co.uk>:
> >
> > Not really. If an article's always going to be a
stub, there's no point having it all.
>
> I disagree that a BLP is ever "always" going
to be a stub - in this
> specific case, many union leaders go into politics; at
the least, he
> may turn into another [[Bob Crow]].
>
> Our inability to predict the future extends to other
categories of
> article, too. For instance, before 1st August 2007,
many might have
> said that [[I-35W Mississippi River bridge]] was
"always going to be a
> stub". Having it existing as a stub probably
helped editors build it
> up when it became somewhat more notable than it
previously had been.
>
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