AFS ... or equivalent ...

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Hi ...

  I recently started working for a company that is using AFS
to mirror their 
data between various data centers, in the US, Asia and the
EU ... the idea is 
that the several thousand servers that are being run have
access to identical 
information ..

  Now, depressingly enough, it looks like OpenAFS works on
everything *but* BSD 
... :(

    IBM AFS for AIX, Version 3.6
    IBM AFS for Digital Unix, Version 3.6
    IBM AFS for HP-UX, Version 3.6
    IBM AFS for Linux, Version 3.6
    IBM AFS for SGI IRIX, Version 3.6
    IBM AFS for Solaris, Version 3.6

  Does anyone know if there is any serious work being done
to get AFS working 
under FreeBSD?  I have a large project that I'm working on
that AFS (or 
something equivalent) would be *very* useful for, but we're
trying to keep it 
as FreeBSD-pure as possible ...

  Thoughts?  Pointers?

- ----
Marc G. Fournier           Hub.Org Networking Services (http://www.hub.org)
Email . scrappyhub.org                              MSN .
scrappyhub.org
Yahoo . yscrappy               Skype: hub.org        ICQ .
7615664
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Marc G. Fournier wrote:
> 
>   Does anyone know if there is any serious work being
done to get AFS working 
> under FreeBSD?  I have a large project that I'm working
on that AFS (or 
> something equivalent) would be *very* useful for, but
we're trying to keep it 
> as FreeBSD-pure as possible ...

Yes.  Please get in touch with any of the people CC'ed in
this list.  I 
believe Matt Benjamin is the one who is actually getting
serious on this 
project.  Patches were even mentioned in a recent email.  I
recall Jim 
Rees is knowledgeable on AFS.  I also think one Derrick J.
Brashear was 
interested/knowledgeable too, but I don't have his address
handy.  If I 
misrepesented anyone please feel free to correct me.

Matt, if you do not know Marc, look up Postgresql.  Marc is
the port 
maintainer for postgresql as well as a postgres developer.
(iirc)

Me, I am just a user who put together an ugly, ugly little
FreeBSD port 
a long time ago in the hope that it would inspire some
people who were 
qualified to do real work to pick it up and run with it.

There are a couple mailing lists suitable for FreeBSD
porting 
discussions.  One is run by the OpenAFS people and the other
is run by 
FreeBSD people.

Sorry for the spam and cross posts. It seems like the
interest in 
OpenAFS on FreeBSD is building.  I hope that this message
will put the 
right people in touch with each other and that maybe a
concerted effort 
to port OpenAFS to FreeBSD will arise.

Later,
Jason

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HELLO,

CHECK OUT CODA, IT'S ALSO A DISTRIBUTED FILESYSTEM, AND HAS
AN UPDATED
KERNEL MODULE IN 7-STABLE. THE BITS IN 6.X ARE OUT-OF-DATE,
BUT IT WILL
BE BACK IN BUSINESS FROM 7.

ON MON, JAN 14, 2008 AT 12:34:24AM -0400, MARC G. FOURNIER
WROTE:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> HASH: SHA1
> 
> 
> HI ...
> 
>   I RECENTLY STARTED WORKING FOR A COMPANY THAT IS
USING AFS TO MIRROR THEIR 
> DATA BETWEEN VARIOUS DATA CENTERS, IN THE US, ASIA AND
THE EU ... THE IDEA IS 
> THAT THE SEVERAL THOUSAND SERVERS THAT ARE BEING RUN
HAVE ACCESS TO IDENTICAL 
> INFORMATION ..
> 
>   NOW, DEPRESSINGLY ENOUGH, IT LOOKS LIKE OPENAFS WORKS
ON EVERYTHING *BUT* BSD 
> ... :(
> 
>     IBM AFS FOR AIX, VERSION 3.6
>     IBM AFS FOR DIGITAL UNIX, VERSION 3.6
>     IBM AFS FOR HP-UX, VERSION 3.6
>     IBM AFS FOR LINUX, VERSION 3.6
>     IBM AFS FOR SGI IRIX, VERSION 3.6
>     IBM AFS FOR SOLARIS, VERSION 3.6
> 
>   DOES ANYONE KNOW IF THERE IS ANY SERIOUS WORK BEING
DONE TO GET AFS WORKING 
> UNDER FREEBSD?  I HAVE A LARGE PROJECT THAT I'M WORKING
ON THAT AFS (OR 
> SOMETHING EQUIVALENT) WOULD BE *VERY* USEFUL FOR, BUT
WE'RE TRYING TO KEEP IT 
> AS FREEBSD-PURE AS POSSIBLE ...
> 
>   THOUGHTS?  POINTERS?
> 
> - ----
> MARC G. FOURNIER           HUB.ORG NETWORKING SERVICES
(HTTP://WWW.HUB.ORG)
> EMAIL . SCRAPPYHUB.ORG                              MSN .
SCRAPPYHUB.ORG
> YAHOO . YSCRAPPY               SKYPE: HUB.ORG       
ICQ . 7615664
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> 
> _______________________________________________
> FREEBSD-FSFREEBSD.ORG MAILING LIST
> HTTP://LISTS.FREEBSD.ORG/MAILMAN/LISTINFO/FREEBSD-FS
> TO UNSUBSCRIBE, SEND ANY MAIL TO
"FREEBSD-FS-UNSUBSCRIBEFREEBSD.ORG"
> 

SINCERELY,

GERGELY CZUCZY
MAILTO: GERGELY.CZUCZYHARMLESS.HU

-- 
WEENIES TEST. GENIUSES SOLVE PROBLEMS THAT ARISE.

The server runs on FreeBSD as far as I know.  There is a
client, and I think
it still builds if you apply Matt's patches, which are in
the OpenAFS bug
tracking system.  But it doesn't run.  No one is actively
maintaining the
FreeBSD port.
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On Sun, 13 Jan 2008, Jason C. Wells wrote:

> Marc G. Fournier wrote:
>
>> Does anyone know if there is any serious work being
done to get AFS working 
>> under FreeBSD?  I have a large project that I'm
working on that AFS (or 
>> something equivalent) would be *very* useful for,
but we're trying to keep 
>> it as FreeBSD-pure as possible ...
>
> Yes.  Please get in touch with any of the people CC'ed
in this list.  I 
> believe Matt Benjamin is the one who is actually
getting serious on this 
> project.  Patches were even mentioned in a recent
email.  I recall Jim Rees 
> is knowledgeable on AFS.  I also think one Derrick J.
Brashear was 
> interested/knowledgeable too, but I don't have his
address handy.  If I 
> misrepesented anyone please feel free to correct me.
>
> Matt, if you do not know Marc, look up Postgresql. 
Marc is the port 
> maintainer for postgresql as well as a postgres
developer. (iirc)
>
> Me, I am just a user who put together an ugly, ugly
little FreeBSD port a 
> long time ago in the hope that it would inspire some
people who were 
> qualified to do real work to pick it up and run with
it.
>
> There are a couple mailing lists suitable for FreeBSD
porting discussions. 
> One is run by the OpenAFS people and the other is run
by FreeBSD people.
>
> Sorry for the spam and cross posts. It seems like the
interest in OpenAFS on 
> FreeBSD is building.  I hope that this message will put
the right people in 
> touch with each other and that maybe a concerted effort
to port OpenAFS to 
> FreeBSD will arise.

Arla, which is just an AFS client, runs on some versions of
FreeBSD, although 
typically not really recent ones.  I spent a little time
this summer looking 
at getting it updated to 7, but ran out of time.

I'd like very much to get at least the kernel parts of an
AFS client into the 
base system, as otherwise any AFS port (be it Arla, OpenAFS,
etc) will 
constantly be falling behind and breaking as the base tree
moves forward. 
Our VFS tends to change with moderate speed, and having it
in the base tree 
will allow it to be updated as part of regular changes to
our KPI by the 
author of the changes, rather than watching more and more
ifdefs appear in a 
third-party tree.  I'm happy to lend a hand with this, but I
don't have the 
time (apparently) to drive a port forward myself right now.

Robert N M Watson
Computer Laboratory
University of Cambridge
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For those of you who haven't seen this.  Here is my
rudimentary port. 
It is nothing more than the FreeBSD parts wrapped around the
OpenAFS 
source.  I think I was working on version 5 of FreeBSD but I
don't 
recall for sure.  This was version OpenAFS 1.4.2.  It
compiled. The 
kernel module loaded. I was able to get tokens using the
system heimdal. 
I even got a directory listing via the client. Attempting to
manipulate 
files resulted in an immediate panic.

http:/
/www.stradamotorsports.com/~jcw/openafs/

I would advise those who are interested to discuss and
choose a mailing 
list for continuing the effort.  We are currently writing
four different 
lists in this thread.

I'll test whatever you guys come up with.  I'll be running
FreeBSD-6.3 
real soon now.

Later,
Jason
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On Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 12:34:24AM -0400, Marc G. Fournier
wrote:
> 
> Hi ...
>   I recently started working for a company that is
using AFS to mirror their 
> data between various data centers, in the US, Asia and
the EU ... the idea is 
> that the several thousand servers that are being run
have access to identical 
> information ..
> 
> Now, depressingly enough, it looks like OpenAFS works
on everything *but* 
> BSD ... :(
> 
>     IBM AFS for AIX, Version 3.6
>     IBM AFS for Digital Unix, Version 3.6
>     IBM AFS for HP-UX, Version 3.6
>     IBM AFS for Linux, Version 3.6
>     IBM AFS for SGI IRIX, Version 3.6
>     IBM AFS for Solaris, Version 3.6
> 
>   Does anyone know if there is any serious work being
done to get AFS working 
> under FreeBSD?  I have a large project that I'm working
on that AFS (or 
> something equivalent) would be *very* useful for, but
we're trying to keep it 
> as FreeBSD-pure as possible ...

Well, there is a client-only AFS project called Arla.   I
have been 
using it for about 1 1/2 years with no problem.   But, it
tends to 
be some versions behind in the FreeBSD it supports.  Whoever
supports
it apparently doesn't have the time or other resources to
keep up to
the most recent FreeBSD versions.

I have been told by persons who have done an AFS port here
to a proprietary
BSD based UNIX (but not any of the current free ones),  that
the difficuly
part is the client and that the server is relatively easy to
port.  The
reason being that the client has to reach deep in to the
kernel, but
the server does not - is pretty much sufficient unto
itself.

I know that one of the impediments in the past was the
politics with 
the AFS group that was spun out of CMU, vs IBM vs some other
interests 
and whose pocketbook was going to get gored all confounded
with some 
claims for a newer, more wonderful thing called DFS which
was supposed 
to obsolete AFS and also be integrated with a distrubuted
queueing system, 
but which now seems like will never become real.  

But those issues are fairly ancient and mostly settled.  
OpenAFS seems 
to be the result and it runs well on the systems listed in
the OP.  So it 
would seem like folks could just ignore all that and move on
to getting
a good working OpenAFS port -- if only enough people could
spare the
resources for doing the necessary work.

I would sure like to see both a good AFS client and an AFS
server become
well supported.    OpenAFS has some new big technical issues
to solve.
Maybe having the smarts of FreeBSD contributing to the
thinking, it would
help those issues come to reasonable solutions too.

////jerry

> 
>   Thoughts?  Pointers?
> 
> - ----
> Marc G. Fournier           Hub.Org Networking Services
(http://www.hub.org)
> Email . scrappyhub.org                              MSN .
scrappyhub.org
> Yahoo . yscrappy               Skype: hub.org       
ICQ . 7615664
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> Marc G. Fournier wrote:
> >
> >  Does anyone know if there is any serious work
being done to get AFS 
> >  working under FreeBSD?  I have a large project
that I'm working on that 
> >AFS (or something equivalent) would be *very*
useful for, but we're trying 
> >to keep it as FreeBSD-pure as possible ...

Recent work has been done with arla to work with FreeBSD
6.x.  See this
thread:

https://lists.stacken.kth.se/piperm
ail/arla-drinkers/2008-January/004158.html

-- Rick C. Petty
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Hi guys (took a few locations off the cc, hope that's
ok...),

I think there's good support from the openafs side for this.
 Derrick is
supportive.  Jim is interested in seeing patches.  (Openafs
gatekeeper/elder folks.)  I can commit some development time
to it.  I
did some easy build cleanups for FreeBSD 7, and submitted
them.  If
there's something formal we should be doing, let Derrick
know.

Matt

- --

Matt Benjamin

The Linux Box
206 South Fifth Ave. Suite 150
Ann Arbor, MI  48104

http://linuxbox.com

tel. 734-761-4689
fax. 734-769-8938
cel. 734-216-5309

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Matt Benjamin wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
> 
> Hi guys (took a few locations off the cc, hope that's
ok...),

I am pretty sure that the larger number of the people in
this discussion 
are already subscribed to port-freebsdopenafs.org.  No one piped
up so 
I'll make a proposal.  I invite the others to subscribe to 
port-freebsdopenafs.org and use it for porting efforts.

Matt, it looks like your the one with the desire to work
this in 
earnest. It also looks like some pretty capable people are
speaking up 
about OpenAFS. I'm thrilled.

If you can post a port or patches to a website on a regular
basis I will 
gladly try to build them on regular basis. I'll help in my
userly way.

Later,
Jason C. Wells
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