Future of teamwork plugin

Hi,

recently the question was raised on kde-devel why KDE4
depends on Boost
(kdepimlibs dependecy here) and during the thread it was
pointed out
that KDevPlatform's teamwork plugin also depends on Boost.

Now currently teamwork is completely disabled because it
doesn't build
on dashboard due to problems with the boost-libs installed
there and
nobody has the time and ressources to maintain it and thus
fix the
problems. Also there's at least 1 porting effort needed
since the
KComponentData change yesterday.

I'm thinking we should move this plugin to
playground/kdevelop4-extra-plugins, because it clearly isn't
anywhere
close to being maintainable in a kind-of-library module. The
code is a
mess, its very complicated and its very much code. 

Apart from that it doesn't build on win32 and probably will
not until
parts of it are ported to Qt (at least the CommonC++ stuff,
Boost
recently started efforts to use CMake).

I'm voting to move it out of the platform and into
playground/kdevelop4-extra-plugins. Yes if it works well it
will be a
really useful plugin (Eclipse recently started with
communications
stuff), but we need to be able to maintain it and this can't
be guaranteed
currently.

Andreas

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On Tuesday, 3. July 2007, Andreas Pakulat wrote:
> I'm voting to move it out of the platform and into
> playground/kdevelop4-extra-plugins. Yes if it works
well it will be a
> really useful plugin (Eclipse recently started with
communications
> stuff), but we need to be able to maintain it and this
can't be guaranteed
> currently.

We were just discussing it at aKademy here, in the KDevelop
BoF, and came to 
the exact same conclusion. (We, that is, Alexander, Andras,
Jens, Aleix, 
Harald and me).

I think you've got some strong support for moving the
teamwork plugin.

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On Tuesday 03 July 2007 08:13:04 Jakob Petsovits wrote:
> On Tuesday, 3. July 2007, Andreas Pakulat wrote:
> > I'm voting to move it out of the platform and
into
> > playground/kdevelop4-extra-plugins. Yes if it
works well it will be a
> > really useful plugin (Eclipse recently started
with communications
> > stuff), but we need to be able to maintain it and
this can't be
> > guaranteed currently.
>
> We were just discussing it at aKademy here, in the
KDevelop BoF, and came
> to the exact same conclusion. (We, that is, Alexander,
Andras, Jens, Aleix,
> Harald and me).
>
> I think you've got some strong support for moving the
teamwork plugin.
>
> _______________________________________________
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o/kdevelop-devel
I agree too
Mathieu


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Am Dienstag, 3. Juli 2007 14:13:04 schrieb Jakob Petsovits:
> On Tuesday, 3. July 2007, Andreas Pakulat wrote:
> > I'm voting to move it out of the platform and
into
> > playground/kdevelop4-extra-plugins. Yes if it
works well it will be a
> > really useful plugin (Eclipse recently started
with communications
> > stuff), but we need to be able to maintain it and
this can't be
> > guaranteed currently.

So the fact that the stable network-code is not written in
qt makes it 
unmaintainable? Isn't this fascism on toolkit-level?

If we would disable the patch-management part, we'd have a
usable plugin that 
is more stable than any other part of kdevelop-4 currently
is.

However It's true that I have no time to work on it, so if
the code is really 
so scary for you, move it away.


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On 03.07.07 18:04:27, David Nolden wrote:
> Am Dienstag, 3. Juli 2007 14:13:04 schrieb Jakob
Petsovits:
> > On Tuesday, 3. July 2007, Andreas Pakulat wrote:
> > > I'm voting to move it out of the platform and
into
> > > playground/kdevelop4-extra-plugins. Yes if it
works well it will be a
> > > really useful plugin (Eclipse recently
started with communications
> > > stuff), but we need to be able to maintain it
and this can't be
> > > guaranteed currently.
> 
> So the fact that the stable network-code is not written
in qt makes it 
> unmaintainable? Isn't this fascism on toolkit-level?

Oh, its stable? Do you have tests to prove that? And no, the
fact that
its hard to understand for anybody but the original author
makes it hard
to maintain. The fact that we lack resources anyway doesn't
allow us to
keep code that will be unmaintained for another 2 months
(and doesn't
even compile on all developers machines).

Andreas, who is rather scared by the code.

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On Tuesday 03 July 2007 12:04:27 David Nolden wrote:
> Am Dienstag, 3. Juli 2007 14:13:04 schrieb Jakob
Petsovits:
> > On Tuesday, 3. July 2007, Andreas Pakulat wrote:
> > > I'm voting to move it out of the platform and
into
> > > playground/kdevelop4-extra-plugins. Yes if it
works well it will be a
> > > really useful plugin (Eclipse recently
started with communications
> > > stuff), but we need to be able to maintain it
and this can't be
> > > guaranteed currently.
>
> So the fact that the stable network-code is not written
in qt makes it
> unmaintainable? Isn't this fascism on toolkit-level?
>
> If we would disable the patch-management part, we'd
have a usable plugin
> that is more stable than any other part of kdevelop-4
currently is.
>
> However It's true that I have no time to work on it, so
if the code is
> really so scary for you, move it away.
Hi David,
I have a few questions about this plugin. 
the first one is why did you wrote a complete network
protocol instead of 
using something like jabber, which can easily be extended to
support most (if 
not all ) the features one might expect of this kind of
plugin?

I think 1 qualifies as "a few questions" ;)
Mathieu

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On Tuesday 03 July 2007, David Nolden wrote:
> However It's true that I have no time to work on it, so
if the code
> is really so scary for you, move it away.

Even if we abstract from the code content itself, if you
admit that you 
have no time to work on and as it was not really tested for
the simple 
case that KDevelop4 is pretty much in unusable state, and as
KDevelop4 
will continue to move forward, this is enough to say that
your code 
shouldn't stay *now* in kdevplatform. 
 
Andras

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rg
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Am Dienstag, 3. Juli 2007 18:26:07 schrieb Andreas Pakulat:
> Oh, its stable? Do you have tests to prove that?
1 Month of testing. During the last month of development, I
didn't have to 
touch the networking code any more, while testing
higher-level network 
features.

Since the code has no dependencies that can cause new
regressions, it's quite 
probable that it stayed stable.



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Am Dienstag, 3. Juli 2007 18:28:31 schrieb mchouinard:
> Hi David,
> I have a few questions about this plugin.
> the first one is why did you wrote a complete network
protocol instead of
> using something like jabber, which can easily be
extended to support most
> (if not all ) the features one might expect of this
kind of plugin?
>
> I think 1 qualifies as "a few questions" ;)
> Mathieu

The networking-code is generally abstracted into
"users", "sessions". It would 
be quite easy to extend it to use jabber, and I think it
would be great. All 
necessary would be enabling Teamwork::Client to manage a
user-list from a 
jabber-account, and writing a specialization of
Teamwork::Session(or similar 
named) that can send/receive data and attach one such
session to each 
jabber-user.

So in the end using jabber would have ment some additional
work, and the 
planned feature-list was too long to do that. 
Besides, I didn't know about jabber when I wrote the
proposal. 

Btw. I'm not sure though whether jabber would be usable for
real-time editing 
of a document.

greetings, David


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On 7/3/07, Andras Mantia <amantiakde.org> wrote:
> Even if we abstract from the code content itself, if
you admit that you
> have no time to work on and as it was not really tested
for the simple
> case that KDevelop4 is pretty much in unusable state,
and as KDevelop4
> will continue to move forward, this is enough to say
that your code
> shouldn't stay *now* in kdevplatform.
I'd like to stress the "now" part here. Once you
have some time
working on it and polishing its code we can move it back
because
basically everybody agrees teamwork is cool.

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