UI questions

Hello,

I have several question about KDevelop4 interface as applies
to
debugger:

1. Can user move tool views -- say, somebody
might not like variables view on the left, and want it on
the bottom.
Is this possible.

2. Is there any way to group tool views. Say, I want that by
default,
there's "Debug" tab on the bottom that has both
stack frame and
variables. The user should be able to drag
"Variables" away to
a separate tab, and then drag it back, if so desired.

3. Can we have some notion of "perspectives". I
think that auto-hiding
tool view are nice, however when debugging this is not good
-- and it's
probably not good to ask the use to manually
"lock" the debug views.
So, I'd prefer a separate "debug" perspective that
I'll switch to when
debugger starts, and switch back from when debugger exits.
There will
be some predefined UI settings in debug perspective, but
should user
dislike them, he can drag views as needed, and it should be
saved in
the debug perspective itself. Note that this means that
position of
all views must be save -- which appears to be not the case.

4. Can we have those perspectives work for multiple windows?
Say, so that
when I start debugging, a second window of kdevelop starts
showing debug views.

5. Can I have random content in the middle of the window? If
debugging at
assembler level, I'd much rather have *big* disassembler
windows,
together with stack trace/variables/register windows open.
Naturally, I'd
want this disassembler window shown where regular text is
usually shown.

If somebody's working on any of this, it would be great. If
no -- I'll add
this to my todo 

In fact, something like Eclipse, where the layout of window
is totally
configurable, would be nice, but at the moment I don't know
how to do
that while still retaining the auto-close behaviour.

- Volodya
	

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On Friday 07 December 2007 19:22, Vladimir Prus wrote:
> 3. Can we have some notion of "perspectives".
I think that auto-hiding
...
> 4. Can we have those perspectives work for multiple
windows? Say, so that
> when I start debugging, a second window of kdevelop
starts showing debug
> views.
> 5. Can I have random content in the middle of the
window? If debugging at
...
Yes, yes and yes. These all things you ask for is exactly
what sublime library 
does. But, there's a problem... I know all that is possible
in theory but I 
don't remember whether I debugged all bugs and provided all
necessary 
interfaces to the functionality. Also I've tested the new
ideal mode only 
once. It seemed to work fine with the "new window"
functionality so I suspect 
it's about a week of work to bring us the stuff you've
asked.

3. "perspective" == "area" in KDevelop.
You can create new areas or clone 
existing. For instance, "new window" action clones
current area and shows all 
its toolviews/views in the new window.
What we don't have is the support for plugin-definable
areas. I think debugger 
plugin can decide that it will need its own area and specify
which views 
should be visible by default there.
Even now the user can add new views to any area (it's
view->add toolview iirc) 
but the configuration is not yet saved to disk.

4. Areas in KDevelop may be shown in current mainwindow or
(by default) in new 
mainwindow. That's not a problem.

5. Sublime doesn't care whether you add editors or other
views into the 
central widget. IIRC it's only KDevelop's shell classes
which don't provide 
the necessary interfaces. It should be noted that non-kpart
views aren't well 
tested yet.

PS: I think I'll can actively work on this only after new
year and before 
Christmas (orthodoxal one) so feel free to fix/implement
anything you need 
earlier ;)


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On 07.12.07 20:22:37, Vladimir Prus wrote:
> I have several question about KDevelop4 interface as
applies to
> debugger:
> 
> 1. Can user move tool views

See, that happens when you don't follow this list :P

> -- say, somebody might not like variables view on the
left, and want
> it on the bottom.  Is this possible.

Sooner or later yes, hopefully including drag'n'drop.

> 2. Is there any way to group tool views. Say, I want
that by default,
> there's "Debug" tab on the bottom that has
both stack frame and
> variables. The user should be able to drag
"Variables" away to
> a separate tab, and then drag it back, if so desired.

No, and I don't see the reason. You've got the toolview
buttons. There
is support planned to have two toolviews in the same area
open at the
same time, i.e. you could have the GDB+Framestack toolview
sitting side
by side on the bottom.

> 3. Can we have some notion of
"perspectives".

AFAIK at least 50% implemented, try creating a new
mainwindow - thats
your new perspective.

> 4. Can we have those perspectives work for multiple
windows? Say, so that
> when I start debugging, a second window of kdevelop
starts showing debug views.

See above, thats the default today. AFAIK there's no working
support yet
for switching perspective within the same mainwindow.

> 5. Can I have random content in the middle of the
window?

What does that have to do with Ui? ;)

In theory yes, but you need to provide your own document
implementation
and unfortunately also a url. I was thinking about changing
the latter,
so that the documentController allows to open a document
directly by
giving a IDocument instance. 

The first part is already implemented for the designer
intergration.

> If somebody's working on any of this, it would be
great. If no -- I'll add
> this to my todo 

Hamish started on the ideal stuff and that got carried away
with the
debug/run stuff.

Andreas

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On Friday 07 December 2007 22:56:40 Andreas Pakulat wrote:
> On 07.12.07 20:22:37, Vladimir Prus wrote:
> > I have several question about KDevelop4 interface
as applies to
> > debugger:
> > 
> > 1. Can user move tool views
> 
> See, that happens when you don't follow this list :P
> 
> > -- say, somebody might not like variables view on
the left, and want
> > it on the bottom.  Is this possible.
> 
> Sooner or later yes, hopefully including drag'n'drop.
> 
> > 2. Is there any way to group tool views. Say, I
want that by default,
> > there's "Debug" tab on the bottom that
has both stack frame and
> > variables. The user should be able to drag
"Variables" away to
> > a separate tab, and then drag it back, if so
desired.
> 
> No, and I don't see the reason. You've got the toolview
buttons. There
> is support planned to have two toolviews in the same
area open at the
> same time, i.e. you could have the GDB+Framestack
toolview sitting side
> by side on the bottom.

You mean, that we don't need drag-n-drop, and should use
toolview buttons,
or something else?

- Volodya

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On 08.12.07 01:04:47, Vladimir Prus wrote:
> On Friday 07 December 2007 22:56:40 Andreas Pakulat
wrote:
> > On 07.12.07 20:22:37, Vladimir Prus wrote:
> > > I have several question about KDevelop4
interface as applies to
> > > debugger:
> > > 
> > > 1. Can user move tool views
> > 
> > See, that happens when you don't follow this list
:P
> > 
> > > -- say, somebody might not like variables
view on the left, and want
> > > it on the bottom.  Is this possible.
> > 
> > Sooner or later yes, hopefully including
drag'n'drop.
> > 
> > > 2. Is there any way to group tool views. Say,
I want that by default,
> > > there's "Debug" tab on the bottom
that has both stack frame and
> > > variables. The user should be able to drag
"Variables" away to
> > > a separate tab, and then drag it back, if so
desired.
> > 
> > No, and I don't see the reason. You've got the
toolview buttons. There
> > is support planned to have two toolviews in the
same area open at the
> > same time, i.e. you could have the GDB+Framestack
toolview sitting side
> > by side on the bottom.
> 
> You mean, that we don't need drag-n-drop, and should
use toolview buttons,
> or something else?

No, I thought you wanted to automatically create a new
toolview with a
tabwidget having the variable and stack frame widget. But I
guess that
was just some misunderstanding on my side 

Andreas

-- 
You dialed 5483.

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On Saturday 08 December 2007 01:49:08 Andreas Pakulat
wrote:
> On 08.12.07 01:04:47, Vladimir Prus wrote:
> > On Friday 07 December 2007 22:56:40 Andreas
Pakulat wrote:
> > > On 07.12.07 20:22:37, Vladimir Prus wrote:
> > > > I have several question about KDevelop4
interface as applies to
> > > > debugger:
> > > > 
> > > > 1. Can user move tool views
> > > 
> > > See, that happens when you don't follow this
list :P
> > > 
> > > > -- say, somebody might not like
variables view on the left, and want
> > > > it on the bottom.  Is this possible.
> > > 
> > > Sooner or later yes, hopefully including
drag'n'drop.
> > > 
> > > > 2. Is there any way to group tool views.
Say, I want that by default,
> > > > there's "Debug" tab on the
bottom that has both stack frame and
> > > > variables. The user should be able to
drag "Variables" away to
> > > > a separate tab, and then drag it back,
if so desired.
> > > 
> > > No, and I don't see the reason. You've got
the toolview buttons. There
> > > is support planned to have two toolviews in
the same area open at the
> > > same time, i.e. you could have the
GDB+Framestack toolview sitting side
> > > by side on the bottom.
> > 
> > You mean, that we don't need drag-n-drop, and
should use toolview buttons,
> > or something else?
> 
> No, I thought you wanted to automatically create a new
toolview with a
> tabwidget having the variable and stack frame widget.
But I guess that
> was just some misunderstanding on my side 

Well, there's quite possibly some confusion going on. What I
mean is this:

1. We have a bunch of buttons on bottom.
2. When a button is clicked a dock widget is shown.
3. Inside that doc widget there's a single tool view
widget.

What I want is for a single dock widget to show several tool
view widgets,
alongside, without any tabs. I want such behaviour to be by
default, but
allow the user to move tool views.

- Volodya

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On 08.12.07 11:34:00, Vladimir Prus wrote:
> On Saturday 08 December 2007 01:49:08 Andreas Pakulat
wrote:
> > On 08.12.07 01:04:47, Vladimir Prus wrote:
> > > On Friday 07 December 2007 22:56:40 Andreas
Pakulat wrote:
> > > > On 07.12.07 20:22:37, Vladimir Prus
wrote:
> > > > > I have several question about
KDevelop4 interface as applies to
> > > > > debugger:
> > > > > 
> > > > > 1. Can user move tool views
> > > > 
> > > > See, that happens when you don't follow
this list :P
> > > > 
> > > > > -- say, somebody might not like
variables view on the left, and want
> > > > > it on the bottom.  Is this
possible.
> > > > 
> > > > Sooner or later yes, hopefully including
drag'n'drop.
> > > > 
> > > > > 2. Is there any way to group tool
views. Say, I want that by default,
> > > > > there's "Debug" tab on
the bottom that has both stack frame and
> > > > > variables. The user should be able
to drag "Variables" away to
> > > > > a separate tab, and then drag it
back, if so desired.
> > > > 
> > > > No, and I don't see the reason. You've
got the toolview buttons. There
> > > > is support planned to have two toolviews
in the same area open at the
> > > > same time, i.e. you could have the
GDB+Framestack toolview sitting side
> > > > by side on the bottom.
> > > 
> > > You mean, that we don't need drag-n-drop, and
should use toolview buttons,
> > > or something else?
> > 
> > No, I thought you wanted to automatically create a
new toolview with a
> > tabwidget having the variable and stack frame
widget. But I guess that
> > was just some misunderstanding on my side 
> 
> Well, there's quite possibly some confusion going on.
What I mean is this:
> 
> 1. We have a bunch of buttons on bottom.
> 2. When a button is clicked a dock widget is shown.
> 3. Inside that doc widget there's a single tool view
widget.
> 
> What I want is for a single dock widget to show several
tool view widgets,
> alongside, without any tabs. I want such behaviour to
be by default, but
> allow the user to move tool views.

My terms are a bit different. A dockwidget for me means
QDockWidget. The
thing that pops up in the bottom when you press a button is
a toolview
over here. Its content is just some widget.

That being said, yes, we're on the same page. Having the
possibility to
have 2 widgets displayed in the lower toolview area is
something I want
to have as well. I'm not sure wether both widgets would end
up in the
same toolview (i.e. just one title+toolview buttons) or
you'd get 2
toolviews that sit there side-by-side, i.e. two titles and
each having
their own toolview buttons. But thats an implementation
detail. Also
this would need drag'n'drop support obviously.

Andreas

-- 
You have an unusual understanding of the problems of human
relationships.

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On Mon, 10 Dec 2007 02:52:49 am Andreas Pakulat wrote:
> On 08.12.07 11:34:00, Vladimir Prus wrote:
> > On Saturday 08 December 2007 01:49:08 Andreas
Pakulat wrote:
> > > On 08.12.07 01:04:47, Vladimir Prus wrote:
> > > > On Friday 07 December 2007 22:56:40
Andreas Pakulat wrote:
> > > > > On 07.12.07 20:22:37, Vladimir Prus
wrote:
> > > > > > I have several question about
KDevelop4 interface as applies to
> > > > > > debugger:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 1. Can user move tool views
> > > > >
> > > > > See, that happens when you don't
follow this list :P
> > > > >
> > > > > > -- say, somebody might not
like variables view on the left, and
> > > > > > want it on the bottom.  Is
this possible.
> > > > >
> > > > > Sooner or later yes, hopefully
including drag'n'drop.
> > > > >
> > > > > > 2. Is there any way to group
tool views. Say, I want that by
> > > > > > default, there's
"Debug" tab on the bottom that has both stack
> > > > > > frame and variables. The user
should be able to drag "Variables"
> > > > > > away to a separate tab, and
then drag it back, if so desired.
> > > > >
> > > > > No, and I don't see the reason.
You've got the toolview buttons.
> > > > > There is support planned to have
two toolviews in the same area
> > > > > open at the same time, i.e. you
could have the GDB+Framestack
> > > > > toolview sitting side by side on
the bottom.
> > > >
> > > > You mean, that we don't need
drag-n-drop, and should use toolview
> > > > buttons, or something else?
> > >
> > > No, I thought you wanted to automatically
create a new toolview with a
> > > tabwidget having the variable and stack frame
widget. But I guess that
> > > was just some misunderstanding on my side

> >
> > Well, there's quite possibly some confusion going
on. What I mean is
> > this:
> >
> > 1. We have a bunch of buttons on bottom.
> > 2. When a button is clicked a dock widget is
shown.
> > 3. Inside that doc widget there's a single tool
view widget.
> >
> > What I want is for a single dock widget to show
several tool view
> > widgets, alongside, without any tabs. I want such
behaviour to be by
> > default, but allow the user to move tool views.
>
> My terms are a bit different. A dockwidget for me means
QDockWidget. The
> thing that pops up in the bottom when you press a
button is a toolview
> over here. Its content is just some widget.
>
> That being said, yes, we're on the same page. Having
the possibility to
> have 2 widgets displayed in the lower toolview area is
something I want
> to have as well. I'm not sure wether both widgets would
end up in the
> same toolview (i.e. just one title+toolview buttons) or
you'd get 2
> toolviews that sit there side-by-side, i.e. two titles
and each having
> their own toolview buttons. But thats an implementation
detail. Also
> this would need drag'n'drop support obviously.

BTW, this is already implemented behind the scenes in
ideallayout, I was just 
waiting for someone to propose a suitable UI...

Cheers,
Hamish

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