DRIVER TROUBLES VIRTUALLY UNFIXABLE

Becker: We'll never move beyond the booting and hardware
provisioning problems 
because there's always new hardware coming out. Just about
every month 
there's some changed device. For instance, you can't get
the old chip 
anymore, or there's a new, higher performance I/O chip
that's embedded in the 
system. You're always chasing device support. You always
need to add just 
that one last device driver. 

That will never go away, and imagining that virtualization
will make it go 
away is a mistake. One of the things that people doing
virtual machines think 
they're going to get is only having to provision for one
ideal virtual 
machine. You still have to deal with the underlying
hardware, however, and 
the underlying hardware will always be getting better and
always changing. 
That problem will never go away.

We're about to see another revolution, which is in network
adapters -- that we 
[will] talk directly to [them] from application level.
That's a massive 
change in how you interface with them. And that brings about
a new round of 
device drivers completely unlike the device drivers we had
10 years ago. So, 
that part of the world isn't going to stabilize anytime
soon.

http://go.t
echtarget.com/r/539304/1461419

----
Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE

	I haven't used the technique, but I understand there is
growing use in Linux
of being able to use Windows :-( drivers.  The article
doesn't say so, but this
sounds like what will happen?  ---Jim

GreyGeek wrote:
> Becker: We'll never move beyond the booting and
hardware provisioning problems 
> because there's always new hardware coming out. Just
about every month 
> there's some changed device. For instance, you can't
get the old chip 
> anymore, or there's a new, higher performance I/O chip
that's embedded in the 
> system. You're always chasing device support. You
always need to add just 
> that one last device driver. 
> 
> That will never go away, and imagining that
virtualization will make it go 
> away is a mistake. One of the things that people doing
virtual machines think 
> they're going to get is only having to provision for
one ideal virtual 
> machine. You still have to deal with the underlying
hardware, however, and 
> the underlying hardware will always be getting better
and always changing. 
> That problem will never go away.
> 
> We're about to see another revolution, which is in
network adapters -- that we 
> [will] talk directly to [them] from application level.
That's a massive 
> change in how you interface with them. And that brings
about a new round of 
> device drivers completely unlike the device drivers we
had 10 years ago. So, 
> that part of the world isn't going to stabilize
anytime soon.
> 
> http://go.t
echtarget.com/r/539304/1461419
> 
> ----
> Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
> To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
> with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE
> 
> 
> 

----
Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE

	I haven't used the technique, but I understand there is
growing use in Linux
of being able to use Windows :-( drivers.  The article
doesn't say so, but this
sounds like what will happen?  ---Jim

GreyGeek wrote:
> Becker: We'll never move beyond the booting and
hardware provisioning problems 
> because there's always new hardware coming out. Just
about every month 
> there's some changed device. For instance, you can't
get the old chip 
> anymore, or there's a new, higher performance I/O chip
that's embedded in the 
> system. You're always chasing device support. You
always need to add just 
> that one last device driver. 
> 
> That will never go away, and imagining that
virtualization will make it go 
> away is a mistake. One of the things that people doing
virtual machines think 
> they're going to get is only having to provision for
one ideal virtual 
> machine. You still have to deal with the underlying
hardware, however, and 
> the underlying hardware will always be getting better
and always changing. 
> That problem will never go away.
> 
> We're about to see another revolution, which is in
network adapters -- that we 
> [will] talk directly to [them] from application level.
That's a massive 
> change in how you interface with them. And that brings
about a new round of 
> device drivers completely unlike the device drivers we
had 10 years ago. So, 
> that part of the world isn't going to stabilize
anytime soon.
> 
> http://go.t
echtarget.com/r/539304/1461419
> 
> ----
> Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
> To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
> with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE
> 
> 
> 

----
Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE

On Friday 15 September 2006 9:47 am, Jim Worrest wrote:
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0I haven't used the technique, but
I understand there=
 is growing use
> in Linux of being able to use Windows :-( drivers.
=A0The article doesn't=
 say
> so, but this sounds like what will happen? =A0---Jim

The use of Windows wireless drivers using ndiswrapper is the
only example I=
=20
know if where Windows device drivers are being used in
Linux.   Do you know=
=20
of others?
GreyGeek

----
Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE

	Well, the other place, and now I think they're are native
drivers, but didn't
some distros use Windows material to access NTFS? I think
Linux has come to the
point where it doesn't have to do that. Not having used
wireless and not having
that much NTFS to bother with, I haven't tried either of
those out.  I assume,
more uses of Windows stuff might be used on either permanent
or temporary basis?
 ---Jim

GreyGeek wrote:
> On Friday 15 September 2006 9:47 am, Jim Worrest wrote:
>> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0I haven't used the technique,
but I understand there=
>  is growing use
>> in Linux of being able to use Windows :-( drivers.
=A0The article doesn't=
>  say
>> so, but this sounds like what will happen?
=A0---Jim
> 
> The use of Windows wireless drivers using ndiswrapper
is the only example I=
> =20
> know if where Windows device drivers are being used in
Linux.   Do you know=
> =20
> of others?
> GreyGeek
> 
> ----
> Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
> To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
> with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE
> 
> 
> 

----
Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE

On Sunday 17 September 2006 5:28 am, Jim Worrest wrote:
> =A0=A0=A0=A0Well, the other place, and now I think
they're are native dri=
vers, but
> didn't some distros use Windows material to access
NTFS? I think Linux has
> come to the point where it doesn't have to do that.
Not having used
> wireless and not having that much NTFS to bother with,
I haven't tried
> either of those out. =A0I assume, more uses of Windows
stuff might be use=
d on
> either permanent or temporary basis?

Now that you've jogged my memory, there is at least one
proprietary program=
=20
that uses licensed NTSF technology to access ntfs files from
Linux,=20
http://www.ntfs-linux.com.
   I haven't heard of a single person/organizatio=
n=20
using it and I doubt that it has many users.


However, on 07/14/2006,  Szabolcs Szakacsits presented a new
version of=20
ntfsmount and libntfs, currently given the project title
ntfs-3g. This=20
version has full read/write capabilities, many bug fixes and
improved=20
performance. It has already been downloaded over 40,000
times, tested and=20
regularly used by users with satisfaction over the last two
months. Despite=
=20
of that it is still a strong beta, and will upon (in some
way or the other)=
=20
merge also into the linux-ntfs ntfsprogs package.
http://www.linux-ntfs.org/



Neither of these use wrapper technology on Microsoft
controls.

----
Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE

	It was part of the KNOPPIX HACKS reference to use the
Windows programs rather
then the Linux one to access NTFS files, since the Linux one
would mess up the
Windows XP, etc. file system, which tends to make people
very angry!
	However, the HACKS book is now a couple of years old and no
doubt the native
NTFS access drivers, or whatever you call them work much
better. However, the
computer I have Windows XP on also has Windows 98 on it, so
I just  use that as
a mutual Windows and Linux access point. Linux never messes
up Windows 98. 
  ---Jim

GreyGeek wrote:
> On Sunday 17 September 2006 5:28 am, Jim Worrest wrote:
>> =A0=A0=A0=A0Well, the other place, and now I think
they're are native dri=
> vers, but
>> didn't some distros use Windows material to access
NTFS? I think Linux has
>> come to the point where it doesn't have to do
that. Not having used
>> wireless and not having that much NTFS to bother
with, I haven't tried
>> either of those out. =A0I assume, more uses of
Windows stuff might be use=
> d on
>> either permanent or temporary basis?
> 
> Now that you've jogged my memory, there is at least
one proprietary program=
> =20
> that uses licensed NTSF technology to access ntfs files
from Linux,=20
> http://www.ntfs-linux.com.
   I haven't heard of a single person/organizatio=
> n=20
> using it and I doubt that it has many users.
> 
> 
> However, on 07/14/2006,  Szabolcs Szakacsits presented
a new version of=20
> ntfsmount and libntfs, currently given the project
title ntfs-3g. This=20
> version has full read/write capabilities, many bug
fixes and improved=20
> performance. It has already been downloaded over 40,000
times, tested and=20
> regularly used by users with satisfaction over the last
two months. Despite=
> =20
> of that it is still a strong beta, and will upon (in
some way or the other)=
> =20
> merge also into the linux-ntfs ntfsprogs package.
> http://www.linux-ntfs.org/

> 
> 
> Neither of these use wrapper technology on Microsoft
controls.
> 
> ----
> Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
> To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
> with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE
> 
> 
> 

----
Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE

I basically do the same thing, except I don't have windows
98 on my
system.  Its a lot more reliable to use the FAT32(the
partition type
that windows 98 used_ tools with Linux, rather then some
Hack for NTFS. 
Last year, I bought a 250 GB hard drive, and ended up
formating it with
a windows 98 cd, or maybe it was 95, I'm not sure, but I
did have a 6GB
FAT32 partition on my 80 GB hard drive, and the stupid
windows cd made
that the bootable partition, which messed me up for a couple
of days. 
Now I know better, I would use the mkfs.vfat command, but it
worked and
I have a 250 GB FAT 32 partition, so I don't have to reuse
a 6 GB
partition to do that, and I also don't have to worry about
messing up
the windows partition.  The only problem with this is it
requires extra
space, which I have, especially now.  That and FAT 32 is
slightly less
efficient than NTFS, but to save reformatting because of a
write error,
I believe its worth it.

----
Kyle Brown


Jim Worrest wrote:
> 	It was part of the KNOPPIX HACKS reference to use the
Windows programs rather
> then the Linux one to access NTFS files, since the
Linux one would mess up the
> Windows XP, etc. file system, which tends to make
people very angry!
> 	However, the HACKS book is now a couple of years old
and no doubt the native
> NTFS access drivers, or whatever you call them work
much better. However, the
> computer I have Windows XP on also has Windows 98 on
it, so I just  use that as
> a mutual Windows and Linux access point. Linux never
messes up Windows 98. 
>   ---Jim
>
>
>   
> ----
> Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
> To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
> with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE
>
>   


----
Husker Linux Users Group mailing list
To unsubscribe, send a message to huskerlug-requestfreelists.org
with a subject of UNSUBSCRIBE