Re: Expanding the abbr pattern

On 4/27/07 10:18 AM, "John Beales" <johnjohnbeales.com> wrote:

> Jeremy wrote:
>> The simplest solution is to simply expand the
pattern to allow the
>> same usage of class and title on elements other
than abbr (span is
>> specifically mentioned but this would potentially
apply to any element).
> .........
>> I'd be interested in hearing other arguments for or
against this idea.
> 
> I have another one for.  This isn't from a screen
reader perspective,
> but an IE perspective.
> 
> Because IE doesn't support the abbr element it is very
difficult to
> target anything written using the abbr design pattern
with CSS.

This is no longer true.  IE7 supports the abbr element.

http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms649487.aspx



> If we could use, say, a span this would solve that
problem.

If you must have pixel-perfect rendering for your
content/site in older
browsers that don't support abbr, and you need abbr-specific
styling, then
yes, a workaround is to add a <span> element as a
styling hook for those
older browsers.  However we MUST NOT compromise microformats
for browsers
that failed to implement *an entire HTML4 element*.


Tantek

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> > Jeremy wrote:
> >> The simplest solution is to simply expand the
pattern to allow the
> >> same usage of class and title on elements
other than abbr (span is
> >> specifically mentioned but this would
potentially apply to any element).
> > .........
> >> I'd be interested in hearing other arguments
for or against this idea.
> >
> > I have another one for.  This isn't from a screen
reader perspective,
> > but an IE perspective.
> >
> > Because IE doesn't support the abbr element it is
very difficult to
> > target anything written using the abbr design
pattern with CSS.
>
> This is no longer true.  IE7 supports the abbr
element.

Sorry, I meant to say IE6, not IE in general.

> > If we could use, say, a span this would solve that
problem.
>
> If you must have pixel-perfect rendering for your
content/site in older
> browsers that don't support abbr, and you need
abbr-specific styling, then
> yes, a workaround is to add a <span> element as a
styling hook for those
> older browsers.  However we MUST NOT compromise
microformats for browsers
> that failed to implement *an entire HTML4 element*.

Agreed. However, not being able to style an entire element
in a
browser that still has the lion's share of the market is a
real pain
in the behind.  I don't need a pixel-perfect rendering, but
some
control would be nice without CSS calisthenics.  Maybe we
should just
evangelize FF and/or IE7 more.
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