Re: Microformats UI in Firefox 3

hiya,

I am not so sure that introducing an extra div / element is
the way  
forward as it is requiring even more of the authors. I was
under the  
impression that part of the idea behind microformats was
that the  
tools were to do the donkey work of the process.

I know this isn't wonderfully helpful, as i am not
suggesting an  
alternative (thats for far greater minds than my own) to me
the  
thought of adding a div to my page is alot more of an ask
than a few  
semantic class names. I feel that other may feel the same
way.

just a few thoughts,

^licks^

Jamie & Lion


_______________________________________________
microformats-discuss mailing list
microformats-discussmicroformats.org
http://microformats.org/mailman/listinfo/microforma
ts-discuss

On 9/2/07 4:07 AM, "Jamie Knight" <jamiejkg3.com> wrote:

> hiya,
> 
> I am not so sure that introducing an extra div /
element is the way
> forward as it is requiring even more of the authors.

I tend to agree with Jamie's assessment.


> I was under the  
> impression that part of the idea behind microformats
was that the
> tools were to do the donkey work of the process.

Certainly one way to put it. ;)

Yes one of the goals of microformats is to be a bit more
publisher-centric
in design rather than parser-centric.  That doesn't mean
that we try to make
things completely no work at all for publishers, because
clearly we ask a
little of them, but it does mean that we ask less of them
than most other
standards efforts, which ask publishers to learn new
languages etc.

See the principles for more on this:

 http://microf
ormats.org/wiki/principles


> I know this isn't wonderfully helpful, as i am not
suggesting an
> alternative (thats for far greater minds than my own)
to me the
> thought of adding a div to my page is alot more of an
ask than a few
> semantic class names. I feel that other may feel the
same way.

It is not only quite a lot to ask publishers to "add
another div" to their
pages, but actually undesirable from an overall user
experience standpoint.

*Publishers* of data can't know beforehand all the ways
*users* of that data
will want to use it.

Hence we ask publishers to

mark up data semantically, which enables  *general* re-use.

Rather than asking them to

mark up data semantically and with verbs for *specific*
re-uses.


> just a few thoughts,
> 
> ^licks^
> 
> Jamie & Lion

Thanks Jamie & Lion.


In addition, I found this thread *very* difficult to follow,
as at some
points it seemed like there were implicit proposals for a
taxonomy of
possible user actions (a really bad idea to try to solve
such a huge problem
at this point) or perhaps even a microformat itself for
possible user
actions for which I've seen no research done etc.


As far as discussing microformats user interface in browsers
in general,
please take a look at:

http://microformats.org/wiki/user-interface#Brows
er_Integration

Please consider adding concrete user interface
ideas/screenshots, proposals,
and even challenges/issues there so that we may have a
better record of the
"latest" version of a proposal along with critical
analysis etc.

Tantek

_______________________________________________
microformats-discuss mailing list
microformats-discussmicroformats.org
http://microformats.org/mailman/listinfo/microforma
ts-discuss

sorry for busting in late on this conversation, but let me
get this  
straight, I'm not sure I follow.

1. You guys are proposing a radical change in microformats,
and in  
the way microformats work, and have given us just a week to
discuss/ 
object
2. If radical change is implemented in firefox, all existing
 
microformatted content will fail to work in firefox3
3. said radical change includes inline styles- functionally
identical  
to presentational html tags.
4. In order to play nice with firefox 3, all publishers of 

microformatted content would need to add extra stuff to
their markup.
5. That extra stuff would *only* be necessary for firefox


Are any of the above points incorrect?
_______________________________________________
microformats-discuss mailing list
microformats-discussmicroformats.org
http://microformats.org/mailman/listinfo/microforma
ts-discuss