Re: Mapping Microformats to RDFa

On 10/12/07, Manu Sporny <mspornydigitalbazaar.com>
wrote:
> Great! Where are they? Are the transformations only
available as XSL
> stylesheets? If so, they're not very useful as a
quick-reference for
> publishers... are they?
>

Brian is referring to the RDFa folks rewriting microformats
in RDFa, which
seems like a non-optimal route to take - it's much better to
publish
microformats in the microformat syntax, and then use the
profile attribute to
point GRDDL processors in the right direction. Publishing
microformats as
RDFa seems like a terrific way to ensure that only RDFa
tools can read them.
Follow current practice and all that... ;)

> The hcard2rdf.xsl is licensed under CC-non-commercial,
which makes it
> useless to any company wanting to implement this stuff
in their products.
>

I'm not sure why it would be a problem. You can implement a
commercial GRDDL
processor that pulls in transformation stylesheets from any
number of sources.
The licensing issues would be irrelevant. Just as you don't
have to get a
license to go to a webpage, you don't need a license to load
a GRDDL
stylesheet off the web and run it.

That said, it may be an idea for GRDDL stylesheets to be
released with the
least restrictive licenses one can - like a LGPL type
license.

> hreview2rdfxml.xsl is a 404.
>

The link is just broken. The actual XSLT is:
http://
dannyayers.com/xslt/hreview2rdfxml.xsl

> There are no mappings for hCalendar, hAtom, or hResume,
etc... what am I
> missing? Apologies - I'm not that familiar with GRDDL
tools that are
> available... do you have some good links to GRDDL
tools?
>

http://triplr.org is a nice
example of a GRDDL tool - and the W3C maintain a
reference implementation at http://www.w3.org/20
07/08/grddl/

The W3C also publish glean.py, a GRDDL implementation in
Python:
http://www.w3.org/2
003/g/glean.py

As for stylesheets for other microformats, I'm sure that
people will get
around to writing them. I had a bash at vote-links
recently:
http://tommor
ris.org/profiles/votelinks
If you use vote-links on any of your pages, feel free to add
this URL to the
profile attribute of the page to make your vote-links
available in RDF space.

I'll have a crack at writing some more microformat GRDDL
stylesheets,
specifically focused on elemental microformats. hResume, for
instance, looks
like a nice challenge.

What would help would be if microformats.org could give some
URI-space to hold
some official profile URIs, like:

http://profiles.mic
roformats.org/ (for all)
http://profile
s.microformats.org/hcard
http://pro
files.microformats.org/hcalendar
http://profiles.
microformats.org/xfn
etc.

These would just be simple pages written in valid XHTML 1.0,
containing a link
in the head to the relevant transformation and a link in the
body to the
relevant specification page on the wiki.

-- 
Tom Morris
http://tommorris.org/
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In message 
<d375f00f0710130236q106a3fbdxd0246d78f389d874mail.gmail.com>, Tom 
Morris <tomtommorris.org> writes

>Brian is referring to the RDFa folks rewriting
microformats in RDFa, 
>which seems like a non-optimal route to take - it's much
better to 
>publish microformats in the microformat syntax, and then
use the 
>profile attribute to point GRDDL processors in the right
direction. 
>Publishing microformats as RDFa seems like a terrific
way to ensure 
>that only RDFa tools can read them. Follow current
practice and all 
>that... ;)

And for those of us who publish HTML4.01, not XHTML..?

-- 
Andy Mabbett
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On Oct 13, 2007, at 3:36 AM, Tom Morris wrote:

> Publishing microformats as
> RDFa seems like a terrific way to ensure that only RDFa
tools can  
> read them.

There is no technical reason RDF couldn't be converted into 

microformats just as easily as microformats are converted
into RDF.   
Let's not create political reasons by manufacturing an
unnecessary  
tension between the two.

Peace,
Scott

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On 13/10/07 10:36, "Tom Morris" <tomtommorris.org> wrote:

> On 10/12/07, Manu Sporny <mspornydigitalbazaar.com> wrote:
>> Great! Where are they? Are the transformations only
available as XSL
>> stylesheets? If so, they're not very useful as a
quick-reference for
>> publishers... are they?
>> 
> 
> Brian is referring to the RDFa folks rewriting
microformats in RDFa, which
> seems like a non-optimal route to take - it's much
better to publish
> microformats in the microformat syntax, and then use
the profile attribute to
> point GRDDL processors in the right direction.
Publishing microformats as
> RDFa seems like a terrific way to ensure that only RDFa
tools can read them.
> Follow current practice and all that... ;)

All fine if your intention is just to produce rdf (a noble
thing in itself)

There seem to be 2 sets of criticism of this work:

1. It's not a definitive mapping to rdf-a - just a very
reduced set of rdf-a
markup. But unless GRDDL does more than just glean then it
too is only going
to produce a reduced set rdf representation. It's not going
to take a
contact:fn and know it's a mo:MusicGroup or a
mo:MusicArtist. So the same
limitations apply to Manu's work as apply to GRDDL - you can
only glean
what's there

2. It duplicates work between ufs and rdf-a. Probably true
but... As above I
don't think it's anyone's intention to map ufs to fully
expressive rdf-a.
The work required by both publishers and consumers would be
too much. Rather
it seems like an attempt to map the simple models of ufs
onto the goodness
of rdf-a. So just rdf-a flavoured microformats (or
nana-formats given the
flexibility of rdf - sorry). What it does buy us is
namespaces and that,
imho, is a GOOD THING and missing from ufs

I am in no way criticising microformats and the work done
here - it's all
really cool and works for 80% of users in 80% of cases.
Adding namespaces
might just make it work for another 10%.

Apologies if I'm putting words/opinions in the mouth of Manu
- not my
intention


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