netbsd guide

Hi all,

just wondering, while the NetBSD guide is part of htdocs, do

I need to checkout htdocs completely to be able help on the

guide?

Background, X seems to cover Xfree86 only, while xorg and 
modular xorg is available in pkgsrc too. I was thinking to 
extend this part in a similar way the DragonFly Handbook 
(and most probably FreeBSD) did.

Anybody working on that?

Bernd

On Mon, 23 Apr 2007, Bernd Limbach wrote:
> just wondering, while the NetBSD guide is part of
htdocs, do I need to 
> checkout htdocs completely to be able help on the
guide?

Not sure I guess checking out all of htdocs will be the
least trouble. you 
*may* be lucky to only check out htdocs/guide and possibly
htdocs/share.
Try & see.


> Background, X seems to cover Xfree86 only, while xorg
and modular xorg is 
> available in pkgsrc too. I was thinking to extend this
part in a similar way 
> the DragonFly Handbook (and most probably FreeBSD)
did.
>
> Anybody working on that?

Not that I know of - patches to improve our documentation
are always 
welcome! 


  - Hubert

Hubert Feyrer wrote:

> Not sure I guess checking out all of htdocs will be the
least trouble. 
> you *may* be lucky to only check out htdocs/guide and
possibly 
> htdocs/share.
> Try & see.

Ok.

>> Anybody working on that?
> 
> Not that I know of - patches to improve our
documentation are always 
> welcome! 

There was enough noise in the last weeks about it.

Bernd

Hi,

Bernd Limbach wrote:

> Background, X seems to cover Xfree86 only, while xorg
and
> modular xorg is available in pkgsrc too. I was thinking
to
> extend this part in a similar way the DragonFly
Handbook
> (and most probably FreeBSD) did.


Although I know there are no official rules about what
belongs into the 
guide and what not, the guide should IMHO only be about  the
installation 
and the things that are part of the NetBSD system (src &
xsrc). 

Yes, there are already sections of the guide that transgress
this rule 
(for example sections of the "Using removable
media" chapter), but this 
can be "corrected"  (moved to the "FAQs and
HOWTOs").

As Xorg is still not in the xsrc tree, the documentation
should - for the 
time being - be added to the X11 HOWTOS ("The X Window
system")   


kind regards, Mark 

-- 
Mark Weinem
Jabber: weinemjabber.cz
PGP-Key available

Mark Weinem wrote:

> Although I know there are no official rules about what
belongs into the 
> guide and what not, the guide should IMHO only be about
 the installation 
> and the things that are part of the NetBSD system (src
& xsrc). 

I agree. At the moment, I do not know of any guidelines what
should be
part of the guide and what should not.

Is the guide supposed to be a comprehensive manual for
NetBSD? This
would be similar to what the FreeBSD handbook tries to
achieve, at least
that is what I perceive when I look at the table of
contents:

  Installation, UNIX basics, installing applications, X,
desktop
  applications, multimedia, kernel configuration, printing,
linux
  compatibility, tuning, booting, user management, security,
jails, access
  control, auditing, storage, GEOM, vinum, virtualisation,
localisation,
  freebsd-current, serial communications, slip/ppp, email,
network
  servers, firewalls, advanced networking.

Personally, I would like the guide to "guide" new
users to a full
installation, including X and simple net access. Further
documents (as I
just found out, FreeBSD calls them articles) could be
referenced in the
guide and be separate documents on the web site.
The guide should be printable and available in appropriate
formats like
postscript/PDF, the "articles" could be accessible
over the Internet.

ciao
     Klaus

Klaus Heinz <k.heinz.apr.siebenkh-22.de> wrote:
 
> Personally, I would like the guide to "guide"
new users to a full
> installation, including X and simple net access.
Further documents (as I
> just found out, FreeBSD calls them articles) could be
referenced in the
> guide and be separate documents on the web site.
> The guide should be printable and available in
appropriate formats like
> postscript/PDF, the "articles" could be
accessible over the Internet.

How about splitting content into a "Basic Guide"
and an "Advanced
Guide"?  Or "Install Guide" and "User
Guide"?

-Jan

-- 
Tradition is the illusion of permanence. -- Woody Allen

Jan Schaumann:

> How about splitting content into a "Basic
Guide" and an "Advanced
> Guide"?  Or "Install Guide" and
"User Guide"?

A separate "Install Guide" would be good  (and
it's relative clear what 
belongs into and what not). "User Guide" seems to
unspecific for me.

I'm not sure about a separation into "Basic Guide"
and "Advanced Guide". 
The good thing about the current guide is that one gets
"the whole 
picture" about the NetBSD OS. On the other hand, it's
obvious that the 
guide will still grow (Bluetooth, file systems, ...) and
becomes more and 
more complex (and unhandy?). But will separate guides really
simplify the 
maintenance of the content? 

Though i sympathize with the idea of separate guides, i
don't dare to vote 
for - this will be a lot of work :( 

greetings, Mark

-- 
Mark Weinem
Jabber: weinemjabber.cz
PGP-Key available

Klaus Heinz:

> Is the guide supposed to be a comprehensive manual for
NetBSD? This
> would be similar to what the FreeBSD handbook tries to
achieve, [...]

Yes, and that's what i don't like about the FreeBSD
handbook: it blurs the 
separation between the base OS and the additional
applications (one of 
the famous characteristic of the BSDs)

I like to have a document that "represents" the
tools and features of the 
base OS - all other things should go into separate guides or

HOWTOs/"articles".


ciao, Mark

-- 
Mark Weinem
Jabber: weinemjabber.cz
PGP-Key available

Mark Weinem wrote:
> Klaus Heinz:
> 
>> Is the guide supposed to be a comprehensive manual
for NetBSD? This
>> would be similar to what the FreeBSD handbook tries
to achieve, [...]
> 
> Yes, and that's what i don't like about the FreeBSD
handbook: it blurs the 
> separation between the base OS and the additional
applications (one of 
> the famous characteristic of the BSDs)
> 
> I like to have a document that "represents"
the tools and features of the 
> base OS - all other things should go into separate
guides or 
> HOWTOs/"articles".

I was thinking a bit about that in the last two days after 
Marks comments on my initial email and it makes sense 
considering that NetBSD _is_ the base OS. So it should be 
left like that.

I haven't had a look at htdocs including the guide and the 
HOWTOs etc. (doing cvs checkout now), but the same style 
would be good. This could lead to some sort of an 
"extended/User" guide covering installing and
configuring 
software from pkgsrc, which can lead up to creating a 
desktop environment based on the NetBSD OS.

What about a HOWTO guide book, where various HOWTOs can be 
collected into one guide and evolve? This may can be 
combined with Klaus thought...

Bernd

hi Bernd,

sorry for the late reply


> This could lead to some 
> sort of an "extended/User" guide covering
installing and configuring software 
> from pkgsrc, which can lead up to creating a desktop
environment based on the 
> NetBSD OS.

Sure - go for it.

But is the setup of GNOME or KDE on NetBSD so specific that
a whole
guide book is needed? A few topics (like soundservers, flash
support or
3d graphics setup) should really be documented, but there
should not be
redundant docs (things that are already documented by the
KDE, GNOME or
X.org projects).

I really miss a "Backup (and Restore!) Guide" and
a detailed
OpenVPN HOWTO for NetBSD. Maybe you could start with these



best regards, Mark

-- 
Mark Weinem
Jabber: weinemjabber.cz
PGP-Key available