Total newbie wants to install BSD on G3 PDQ.

On Jun 24, 2006, at 22:28, Shane Ambler wrote:

> On 24/6/2006 8:01, "Brian Durant"
<globetrotterdkdiplomatic- 
> immunity.dk>
> wrote:
>
>>>
>>
>> Wow, so the situation is even worse than with
Linux? I don't really
>> get what the problem is. The argument always seems
to be based on the
>> fact that there is such a plethora of different
combinations and
>> makes of hardware (cards, motherboards, etc.), but
on the PPC
>> platform, Apple has always maintained such a strict
control on the
>> hardware. The only time when this policy changed
was during the clone
>> period.
>
> The biggest problem comes from custom chips that apple
don't  
> release  tech
> specs on how to write drivers for them.
>
>> I haven't been able to get Linux working on either
my recently
>> purchased G3 PDQ or my G5 single (PowerMac 9.1) -
except for Fedora
>> Core PPC 5 (no sound). I would have thought that
the BSDs being more
>> closely related to OS X, the situation would be
less problematic.
>> Apple (claims at least, it) is supporting the Open
Source community
>> and I assumed that would include opening up for
Open Source drivers
>> for Apple gardware.
>>
>> What are the alternatives for the G3 PDQ? Is it
possible to strip
>> down Jaguar (OS X 10.2.8) so that it only runs
opgradable X Window
>> apps? Many OS X apps have passed the cut off OS
(Jaguar) for the PDQ.
>> I know that a modified BootX exists that allows
installation of
>> Tiger, but I really just got the PDQ to run a Linux
or BSD system on.
>>
>> Any advice would be appreciated.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Brian
>>
>
> I would have said that Yellow Dog Linux has the best
Mac linux  
> support that
> I know of but they seem to have disappeared recently.
>
> You can get a copy of darwin (OS X without the gui) and
run that  
> with X
> Windows if you wish or leave it as a CLI machine
depending on what  
> you want
> to use it for.
> http://www.gnu-darwin.org is putting together a system based on  
> darwin and X
> Windows.
>
> You can download darwin from http://www.opensourc
e.apple.com/ 
> darwinsource/
> and use netBSD pkgsrc to add what you want.
>
>
>
> -- 
>
> Shane Ambler
> 007Marketing.com
> Shane007Marketing.com

Many thanks Shane. I have a few follow-up questions:

1) Do you know anything about the installer (graphic, text
or...)

2) Are netBSD pkgsrc and X Windows already part of Darwin
or...?

3) The file is called "darwinppc-602.cdr.gz" The
".gz" I recognize,  
but how does the ".cdr" compare to the
".iso" files that Linux  
distros use?

Cheers,

Brian

thus Brian Durant spake:
> On Jun 24, 2006, at 22:28, Shane Ambler wrote:
> 
>> On 24/6/2006 8:01, "Brian Durant"
<globetrotterdkdiplomatic-immunity.dk>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Wow, so the situation is even worse than with
Linux? I don't really
>>> get what the problem is. The argument always
seems to be based on the
>>> fact that there is such a plethora of different
combinations and
>>> makes of hardware (cards, motherboards, etc.),
but on the PPC
>>> platform, Apple has always maintained such a
strict control on the
>>> hardware. The only time when this policy
changed was during the clone
>>> period.
>>
>> The biggest problem comes from custom chips that
apple don't release  
>> tech
>> specs on how to write drivers for them.
>>
>>> I haven't been able to get Linux working on
either my recently
>>> purchased G3 PDQ or my G5 single (PowerMac 9.1)
- except for Fedora
>>> Core PPC 5 (no sound). I would have thought
that the BSDs being more
>>> closely related to OS X, the situation would be
less problematic.
>>> Apple (claims at least, it) is supporting the
Open Source community
>>> and I assumed that would include opening up for
Open Source drivers
>>> for Apple gardware.
>>>
>>> What are the alternatives for the G3 PDQ? Is it
possible to strip
>>> down Jaguar (OS X 10.2.8) so that it only runs
opgradable X Window
>>> apps? Many OS X apps have passed the cut off OS
(Jaguar) for the PDQ.
>>> I know that a modified BootX exists that allows
installation of
>>> Tiger, but I really just got the PDQ to run a
Linux or BSD system on.
>>>
>>> Any advice would be appreciated.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Brian
>>>
>>
>> I would have said that Yellow Dog Linux has the
best Mac linux support 
>> that
>> I know of but they seem to have disappeared
recently.
>>
>> You can get a copy of darwin (OS X without the gui)
and run that with X
>> Windows if you wish or leave it as a CLI machine
depending on what you 
>> want
>> to use it for.
>> http://www.gnu-darwin.org is putting together a system based on darwin 
>> and X
>> Windows.
>>
>> You can download darwin from 
>> http://
www.opensource.apple.com/darwinsource/
>> and use netBSD pkgsrc to add what you want.
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Shane Ambler
>> 007Marketing.com
>> Shane007Marketing.com
> 
> Many thanks Shane. I have a few follow-up questions:
> 
> 1) Do you know anything about the installer (graphic,
text or...)

last time i tried (2001?) it was purely text-based; should
be the same
today.

> 2) Are netBSD pkgsrc and X Windows already part of
Darwin or...?

you have to get pkgsrc (ftp, cvs, however) since it's not
included, X11
should be provided on the cd and installed, if you choose to
do so.

> 3) The file is called
"darwinppc-602.cdr.gz" The ".gz" I
recognize, but 
> how does the ".cdr" compare to the
".iso" files that Linux distros use?

you can change .cdr to .iso, it's the same (apple slang).

> Cheers,
> 
> Brian

HTH,

-- 
Timo Schoeler | http://riscworks.net/~tis | timo.schoelerriscworks.net
RISCworks -- Perfection is a powerful message
ISP | POWER & PowerPC afficinados | Networking,
Security, BSD services
GPG Key fingerprint = B5F6 68A4 EC45 C309 6770  38C4 50E8
2740 9E0C F20A

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who
understand binary
and those who don't.

On 25/6/2006 6:10, "Brian Durant"
<globetrotterdkdiplomatic-immunity.dk>
wrote:

> On Jun 24, 2006, at 22:28, Shane Ambler wrote:
> 
>> On 24/6/2006 8:01, "Brian Durant"
<globetrotterdkdiplomatic-
>> immunity.dk>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> Wow, so the situation is even worse than with
Linux? I don't really
>>> get what the problem is. The argument always
seems to be based on the
>>> fact that there is such a plethora of different
combinations and
>>> makes of hardware (cards, motherboards, etc.),
but on the PPC
>>> platform, Apple has always maintained such a
strict control on the
>>> hardware. The only time when this policy
changed was during the clone
>>> period.
>> 
>> The biggest problem comes from custom chips that
apple don't
>> release  tech
>> specs on how to write drivers for them.
>> 
>>> I haven't been able to get Linux working on
either my recently
>>> purchased G3 PDQ or my G5 single (PowerMac 9.1)
- except for Fedora
>>> Core PPC 5 (no sound). I would have thought
that the BSDs being more
>>> closely related to OS X, the situation would be
less problematic.
>>> Apple (claims at least, it) is supporting the
Open Source community
>>> and I assumed that would include opening up for
Open Source drivers
>>> for Apple gardware.
>>> 
>>> What are the alternatives for the G3 PDQ? Is it
possible to strip
>>> down Jaguar (OS X 10.2.8) so that it only runs
opgradable X Window
>>> apps? Many OS X apps have passed the cut off OS
(Jaguar) for the PDQ.
>>> I know that a modified BootX exists that allows
installation of
>>> Tiger, but I really just got the PDQ to run a
Linux or BSD system on.
>>> 
>>> Any advice would be appreciated.
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> 
>>> Brian
>>> 
>> 
>> I would have said that Yellow Dog Linux has the
best Mac linux
>> support that
>> I know of but they seem to have disappeared
recently.
>> 
>> You can get a copy of darwin (OS X without the gui)
and run that
>> with X
>> Windows if you wish or leave it as a CLI machine
depending on what
>> you want
>> to use it for.
>> http://www.gnu-darwin.org is putting together a system based on
>> darwin and X
>> Windows.
>> 
>> You can download darwin from http://www.opensourc
e.apple.com/
>> darwinsource/
>> and use netBSD pkgsrc to add what you want.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> 
>> Shane Ambler
>> 007Marketing.com
>> Shane007Marketing.com
> 
> Many thanks Shane. I have a few follow-up questions:
> 
> 1) Do you know anything about the installer (graphic,
text or...)

Text based. I looked at it some time ago - the main hurdle
is initial config
(if you are used to OS X gui config) the release notes had
the initial
config steps I believe.
 
> 2) Are netBSD pkgsrc and X Windows already part of
Darwin or...?

No you will need to install netBSD pkgsrc after darwin then
install Xwindows
from that. Gnu-Darwin is working towards installing Darwin
and Xwindows and
others in one go.
 
> 3) The file is called
"darwinppc-602.cdr.gz" The ".gz" I
recognize,
> but how does the ".cdr" compare to the
".iso" files that Linux
> distros use?
> 
As far as I know .cdr is the same as .iso - I know that
toast burns both of
them as if it was it's own image file. Haven't tried
burning with other
software.

> Cheers,
> 
> Brian
> 
> 

-- 

Shane Ambler
007Marketing.com
Shane007Marketing.com