Xen, PAE, and NetBSD

I realize this topic keeps cropping up, but I've yet to find
an answer
in the netbsd mailing lists.

Debian has recently stopped shipping non-PAE kernels
suitable for
Xen 3's Dom0.  Unfortunately this makes the use
"stock" netbsd
kernels somewhat difficult.

I have seen relatively recent mention that it may be easy to
add support
for < 4G but PAE domU support to NetBSD, but have not
read further on the 
topic.

Has that made it to the form of a patch, or to mainstream?
-- 
Chris Dukes
< elfick> willg: you can't use dell to beat people, it
wouldn't stand up
to the strain... much like attacking a tank with a wiffle
bat

On Tue, Feb 06, 2007 at 05:52:41PM -0500, Chris Dukes
wrote:
> I realize this topic keeps cropping up, but I've yet to
find an answer
> in the netbsd mailing lists.
> 
> Debian has recently stopped shipping non-PAE kernels
suitable for
> Xen 3's Dom0.  Unfortunately this makes the use
"stock" netbsd
> kernels somewhat difficult.
> 
> I have seen relatively recent mention that it may be
easy to add support
> for < 4G but PAE domU support to NetBSD, but have
not read further on the 
> topic.
> 
> Has that made it to the form of a patch, or to
mainstream?

no, AFAIK nobody is working on this yet ...

-- 
Manuel Bouyer <bouyerantioche.eu.org>
     NetBSD: 26 ans d'experience feront toujours la
difference
--

On Tue, Feb 06, 2007 at 05:52:41PM -0500, Chris Dukes
wrote:
> I realize this topic keeps cropping up, but I've yet to
find an answer
> in the netbsd mailing lists.
> 
> Debian has recently stopped shipping non-PAE kernels
suitable for
> Xen 3's Dom0.  Unfortunately this makes the use
"stock" netbsd
> kernels somewhat difficult.
> 
> I have seen relatively recent mention that it may be
easy to add support
> for < 4G but PAE domU support to NetBSD, but have
not read further on the 
> topic.
> 
> Has that made it to the form of a patch, or to
mainstream?

no, AFAIK nobody is working on this yet ...

-- 
Manuel Bouyer <bouyerantioche.eu.org>
     NetBSD: 26 ans d'experience feront toujours la
difference
--

On 2/8/07, Karsten Kruse <tecneeqgmx.net> wrote:
> > Debian has recently stopped shipping non-PAE
kernels suitable for
> > Xen 3's Dom0.  Unfortunately this makes the use
"stock" netbsd
> > kernels somewhat difficult.
>
> I use Debian-4 as Dom0 and NetBSD-4 as DomU, and it
works fine.

Doesn't help if a third party Xen hosting service has no
option but to
use PAE.  The fact that we're lacking PAE is a showstopper
to Xen
these days.  Amazon EC2 could run NetBSD -- *if* we had
PAE.

That PAE is a "gross hack" has no bearing on the
fact that it is a
needed feature.

-- 
-- Todd Vierling <tvduh.org> <tvpobox.com> <toddvierling.name>

On 2/8/07, Karsten Kruse <tecneeqgmx.net> wrote:
> > Debian has recently stopped shipping non-PAE
kernels suitable for
> > Xen 3's Dom0.  Unfortunately this makes the use
"stock" netbsd
> > kernels somewhat difficult.
>
> I use Debian-4 as Dom0 and NetBSD-4 as DomU, and it
works fine.

Doesn't help if a third party Xen hosting service has no
option but to
use PAE.  The fact that we're lacking PAE is a showstopper
to Xen
these days.  Amazon EC2 could run NetBSD -- *if* we had
PAE.

That PAE is a "gross hack" has no bearing on the
fact that it is a
needed feature.

-- 
-- Todd Vierling <tvduh.org> <tvpobox.com> <toddvierling.name>

On Thu, Feb 08, 2007 at 04:36:08PM +0100, Karsten Kruse
wrote:
> Chris Dukes schrieb:
> 
> > Debian has recently stopped shipping non-PAE
kernels suitable for
> > Xen 3's Dom0.  Unfortunately this makes the use
"stock" netbsd
> > kernels somewhat difficult.
> 
> I use Debian-4 as Dom0 and NetBSD-4 as DomU, and it
works fine. What i did
> on Debian:
> 
> apt-get install xen-linux-system-2.6.18-3-xen-686
libc6-xen xen-tools
> 
> NetBSD uses the kernel from a daily snapshot.

That's what I do now.
but the 2.6.18-3 kernels have disappeared from the debian
repositories...

Reverting linux-2.6 to build the non-PAE xen kernels is
proving to be a 
right pain in the butt.
> 
> Karsten Kruse
> 
> -- 
>         www.tecneeq.de    www.newbie-net.de   
blog.onetbsd.de
>   ()
>  </>           GPL-guy: "Argh, they used my
code! :-/"
>  _/_           BSD-guy: "Cool, they used my code!
"

-- 
Chris Dukes
< elfick> willg: you can't use dell to beat people, it
wouldn't stand up
to the strain... much like attacking a tank with a wiffle
bat

On Thu, Feb 08, 2007 at 04:36:08PM +0100, Karsten Kruse
wrote:
> Chris Dukes schrieb:
> 
> > Debian has recently stopped shipping non-PAE
kernels suitable for
> > Xen 3's Dom0.  Unfortunately this makes the use
"stock" netbsd
> > kernels somewhat difficult.
> 
> I use Debian-4 as Dom0 and NetBSD-4 as DomU, and it
works fine. What i did
> on Debian:
> 
> apt-get install xen-linux-system-2.6.18-3-xen-686
libc6-xen xen-tools
> 
> NetBSD uses the kernel from a daily snapshot.

That's what I do now.
but the 2.6.18-3 kernels have disappeared from the debian
repositories...

Reverting linux-2.6 to build the non-PAE xen kernels is
proving to be a 
right pain in the butt.
> 
> Karsten Kruse
> 
> -- 
>         www.tecneeq.de    www.newbie-net.de   
blog.onetbsd.de
>   ()
>  </>           GPL-guy: "Argh, they used my
code! :-/"
>  _/_           BSD-guy: "Cool, they used my code!
"

-- 
Chris Dukes
< elfick> willg: you can't use dell to beat people, it
wouldn't stand up
to the strain... much like attacking a tank with a wiffle
bat

On 2/9/07, Karsten Kruse <tecneeqgmx.net> wrote:
> > The fact that we're lacking PAE is a showstopper
to Xen
> > these days.  Amazon EC2 could run NetBSD -- *if*
we had PAE.
>
> I can't speak for Amazon, but it runs fine for me, even
without PAE.

Runs fine on a PAE mode 32-bit Linux host that you do not
have the
option to reconfigure?

("There's the problem.")

-- 
-- Todd Vierling <tvduh.org> <tvpobox.com> <toddvierling.name>

On 2/9/07, Karsten Kruse <tecneeqgmx.net> wrote:
> > The fact that we're lacking PAE is a showstopper
to Xen
> > these days.  Amazon EC2 could run NetBSD -- *if*
we had PAE.
>
> I can't speak for Amazon, but it runs fine for me, even
without PAE.

Runs fine on a PAE mode 32-bit Linux host that you do not
have the
option to reconfigure?

("There's the problem.")

-- 
-- Todd Vierling <tvduh.org> <tvpobox.com> <toddvierling.name>

On Sun, Feb 11, 2007 at 12:25:10AM -0500, Todd Vierling
wrote:
> Runs fine on a PAE mode 32-bit Linux host that you do
not have the
> option to reconfigure?

Out of technical curiosity:
Why does a domU have to support PAE? AFAIK the page table is
managed by
the Hypervisor. Is the interface to the Hypervisor so badly
designed
that it can't hide such details?

	Kind regards

-- 
Matthias Scheler                                  http://zhadum.org.uk/