Obscure documentation (Was: insertnewbookmark)

On Tue, 2006-09-26 at 18:45 +0200, Jürgen Schmidt wrote:
> G. Roderick Singleton wrote:
> > On Tue, 2006-09-26 at 13:48 +0200, Laurent Godard
wrote:
> >> Hi
> >>
> >>> I agree. One problem though, the
documentation project does not have the
> >>> source documents so it is unlikely that
the documents in the issues will
> >>> ever be updated. Perhaps the component on
the issues is wrong.
> that is wrong we are working on updates frequently, if
the issue hasn't 
> the correct component please simply change it and send
it to me.
> 

Excuse me?  Change it yourself. If you think it is the
correct, leave
it. I do know that it shows up in the documentation project.


> >>>
> >> this is a real problem
> >>
> >> moreover, a lot of enhancements could be done
such as
> >> - translation
> >> - give examples in other programming language
> >>
> >> Laurent
> >>
> > 
> > Let me throw out a proposal for consideration. 
The doc project is more
> > that willing to take on maintenance and
enhancement of the existing set
> > of documents. Why? Because we have manpower with
the technical chops and
> > because we see that projects, like api, are
swamped with other tasks
> > making the docs take a back seat. I can probably
think of other reasons
> > why the api project might like to shift the burden
but, suffice to say,
> > the reasons I have given are likely enough to
start a dialogue.
> > 
> > Think about it, please, and let Scott or I know
whether or not to pursue
> > this idea.
> 
> the issue isn't new and again we are working it. The
question is not if 
> we opensource the guide but rather how will do it and
you should simply 
> accept the fact that it will take some time.
> Before you ask us again and again you can also ask
other authors if they 
> are willing to opensource their books.
> 

WHat is this? I gather from your comments that the guide is
proprietary.
If this is the case then perhaps it is time for the OOo folk
to think
about having one of their own. Certainly an incentive for a
project.
Thanks.

-- 
G. Roderick Singleton <grsingletonopenoffice.org>
OpenOffice.org

G. Roderick Singleton wrote:

> WHat is this? I gather from your comments that the
guide is proprietary.
> If this is the case then perhaps it is time for the OOo
folk to think
> about having one of their own. Certainly an incentive
for a project.
> Thanks.

It seems that you don't know all the facts, so let me
explain them to you.

Jürgen is already working on this matter for quite some
time. It takes
this time, for whatever reasons. Especially Jürgen is one of
the
greatest advocates of open sourcing the DevGuide, but giving
something
into open source is not just throwing it out and shouting
"come and get
it".

I can understand that Jürgen is a little bit upset about
Laurents
question because it was already answered several times, and
the answer
always was: we (the authors) would like to open source it
but it's not
that easy, please be patient.

OTOH if anybody else wants to create a new DevGuide nobody
will complain
against this (provided that its quality would be
sufficient). We have no
commercial interest in the DevGuide.

So please let's not discuss about something that probably
won't happen
ever. Thanks.

Best regards,
Mathias

-- 
Mathias Bauer - OpenOffice.org Application Framework Project
Lead
Please reply to the list only, nospamforMBAgmx.de is
a spam sink.

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On Wed, 2006-09-27 at 08:27 +0200, Mathias Bauer wrote:
> G. Roderick Singleton wrote:
> 
> > WHat is this? I gather from your comments that the
guide is proprietary.
> > If this is the case then perhaps it is time for
the OOo folk to think
> > about having one of their own. Certainly an
incentive for a project.
> > Thanks.
> 
> It seems that you don't know all the facts, so let me
explain them to you.
> 
> Jürgen is already working on this matter for quite
some time. It takes
> this time, for whatever reasons. Especially Jürgen is
one of the
> greatest advocates of open sourcing the DevGuide, but
giving something
> into open source is not just throwing it out and
shouting "come and get
> it".

Did I say anything about "come and get it¨? No. What I
proposed was that
this document could be handled in the doc project. 

> 
> I can understand that Jürgen is a little bit upset
about Laurents
> question because it was already answered several times,
and the answer
> always was: we (the authors) would like to open source
it but it's not
> that easy, please be patient.

Actually I think he reacted so strongly to my comment on the
component
perhaps being incorrect. The doc project does not have the
source for
the document but the issue shows up in our queue. I thought
that we
might help.

> 
> OTOH if anybody else wants to create a new DevGuide
nobody will complain
> against this (provided that its quality would be
sufficient). We have no
> commercial interest in the DevGuide.
> 

You know this might not be a bad idea. I will ask to see if
any are
interested. What with the contest, I do not expect a swift
response but
who knows.

> So please let's not discuss about something that
probably won't happen
> ever. Thanks.
> 

Okay. Forget it was mentioned. 
-- 
PLEASE KEEP MESSAGES ON THE LIST.
OpenOffice.org Documentation Co-Lead
http://documenta
tion.openoffice.org/ 

G. Roderick Singleton wrote:

> Actually I think he reacted so strongly to my comment
on the component
> perhaps being incorrect. The doc project does not have
the source for
> the document but the issue shows up in our queue. I
thought that we
> might help.

Help is always appreciated. 

As I already wrote, I will take care for the correct
assignment of the
issues. At the end it will be one of the developers who has
to provide
the documentation content so I will search for the right
one.

>> OTOH if anybody else wants to create a new DevGuide
nobody will complain
>> against this (provided that its quality would be
sufficient). We have no
>> commercial interest in the DevGuide.
> 
> You know this might not be a bad idea. I will ask to
see if any are
> interested. What with the contest, I do not expect a
swift response but
> who knows.

My personal opinion (and the one of Jürgen as well IIRC) is
that we want
to hand over the DevGuide to the community. Jürgen might
correct me
later if I'm wrong, currently he's on a business trip.

This will still not change a lot as most of the content will
still come
from the "core" developers but at least there will
be a chance for
others to contribute and of course to translate. Let's hope
for the best.

Best regards,
Mathias

-- 
Mathias Bauer - OpenOffice.org Application Framework Project
Lead
Please reply to the list only, nospamforMBAgmx.de is
a spam sink.

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On Wed, 2006-09-27 at 18:29 +0200, Mathias Bauer wrote:
> G. Roderick Singleton wrote:
> 
> > Actually I think he reacted so strongly to my
comment on the component
> > perhaps being incorrect. The doc project does not
have the source for
> > the document but the issue shows up in our queue.
I thought that we
> > might help.
> 
> Help is always appreciated. 
> 
> As I already wrote, I will take care for the correct
assignment of the
> issues. At the end it will be one of the developers who
has to provide
> the documentation content so I will search for the
right one.
> 
> >> OTOH if anybody else wants to create a new
DevGuide nobody will complain
> >> against this (provided that its quality would
be sufficient). We have no
> >> commercial interest in the DevGuide.
> > 
> > You know this might not be a bad idea. I will ask
to see if any are
> > interested. What with the contest, I do not expect
a swift response but
> > who knows.
> 
> My personal opinion (and the one of Jürgen as well
IIRC) is that we want
> to hand over the DevGuide to the community. Jürgen
might correct me
> later if I'm wrong, currently he's on a business trip.
> 
> This will still not change a lot as most of the content
will still come
> from the "core" developers but at least there
will be a chance for
> others to contribute and of course to translate. Let's
hope for the best.
> 
> Best regards,
> Mathias
> 

When the time comes, please remember the documentation
project as a
resource. This is especially true if the source, or even
part of it, for
the current document is made available.  The project's
preferred license
is PDL which you can check out at
ht
tp://www.openoffice.org/project/www/license.html 
-- 
G. Roderick Singleton <grsingletonopenoffice.org>
OpenOffice.org

Hi all

Sorry if i hurted some of you by being so unpatient

> This will still not change a lot as most of the content
will still come
> from the "core" developers but at least there
will be a chance for
> others to contribute and of course to translate. Let's
hope for the best.
> 

i'll be patient, so ...
and perharps recall in 6 months, as usual ;)

i stop any polemic thread here

Laurent

-- 
Laurent Godard <lgodardindesko.com> -
Ingénierie OpenOffice.org
Indesko >> http://www.indesko.com
Nuxeo CPS >> http://www.nuxeo.com - http://www.cps-project.org

Livre "Programmation OpenOffice.org", Eyrolles
2004

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