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Thread: Re: Setting the default language (spell check)




Re: Setting the default language (spell check)
user name
2007-02-07 01:45:42
Christian Lohmaier schrieb:

>> >> So if you load a document it has its
"document language" built in - it's
>> >> the one stored in its default paragraph
style.
>> > 
>> > No, it's not... (Organize tab of the style
doesn't list language
>> > setting)
>> 
>> Interesting. It *does* here.
> 
> Then you're not using the built-in default template,
but some other one
> that already has the langauge set.

No, I'm using the built-in default template, admittedly most
of the time
I'm using StarOffice. But my OOo 2.0 build (the only one I
could grab
immediately) exactly did the same. It is a Sun build (some
of the kind
you can download from OOo), don't know if that's what you
call a
"vanilla" build.

You seem to refer to the "Standard" style, that's
not what I am talking
about. I was refering to the "Default style".
Here's this style from my
styles.xml:

<style:default-style
style:family="paragraph">
   <style:paragraph-properties
fo:hyphenation-ladder-count="no-limit"
	style:text-autospace="ideograph-alpha"
	style:punctuation-wrap="hanging"
	style:line-break="strict"
	style:tab-stop-distance="1.251cm"
	style:writing-mode="page"/>
   <style:text-properties
style:use-window-font-color="true"
	style:font-name="Thorndale"
	fo:font-size="12pt"
	fo:language="de"
	fo:country="DE"
	style:font-name-asian="Andale Sans UI"
	style:font-size-asian="12pt"
style:language-asian="none"
	style:country-asian="none"
style:font-name-complex="Tahoma"
	style:font-size-complex="12pt"
style:language-complex="none"
	style:country-complex="none"
fo:hyphenate="false"
	fo:hyphenation-remain-char-count="2"
	fo:hyphenation-push-char-count="2"/>
</style:default-style>

> That doesn't count since that always shows values, even
when not
> assigned in the style, but only inherited, either from
another inherited
> style of from factory defaults, or from other places in
the document.

Yes, it's an inherited style. All paragraph styles without
an own
language attribute inherit their language setting from the
default
paragraph style. This value is shown in the dialog.

If you manually remove the language and country settings
from the
default paragraph style you will not see a value for the
language in the
dialog for editing the style as obviously in your case. OOo
also will
take the document language from the metadata as a fallback
for the spell
checker. But only then!

If you don't see a value in your dialog you probably  have a
different
default paragraph style. Correct?

As the default style IIRC is hard coded (have to check that)
I wonder
how this can happen.

> I don't really distinguish between documentation and
implementation
> here.
> The wrong documentation (or behaviour) did cost me at
least two hours of
> useless fiddling around.

We don't call something broken that never was correct. Of
course it's
still a bug (and if you spent two hours finding it it surely
is an
unfortunate one for you). You can accuse me of nitpicking.


> It is not in the default paragraph-style, but in the
general section,
> that also contains the default font chosen (since in
vanilla docs, this
> is also not a property of the default paragraph
style).

What do you mean by "general section"? The
"default styles" section? Of
course, that's what I was talking about all the time. And my
documents
*do* have a language set there (see above) and it works as
described.

> For the spellcheck-functionality inside OOo, it might
look like a
> property of the default paragraph style, but on the
xml-level it isn't.
> (of course you can manually set the property in the
style)

As the OP asked for spellchecking I addressed that by
explaining how
spellchecking works with languages. As in my documents a
language is set
in the default paragraph style always (and I assumed the
same is true
for his documents) changing the document language property
in the
metadata wouldn't help at all - even if we didn't have the
bug that the
language can't be set via API. You can try it by hacking the
meta.xml
manually. OOo will ignore the language set there - except if
you also
removed the language in the default style.

Ciao,
Mathias

-- 
Mathias Bauer (mba) - Project Lead OpenOffice.org Writer
OpenOffice.org Engineering at Sun: http://blogs.sun.com/Gu
llFOSS
Please don't reply to "nospamformbagmx.de".
I use it for the OOo lists and only rarely read other mails
sent to it.

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Re: Setting the default language (spell check)
user name
2007-02-09 07:20:45
Hi Mathias, *,

On Wed, Feb 07, 2007 at 08:45:42AM +0100, Mathias Bauer
wrote:
> Christian Lohmaier schrieb:
> 
> >> >> So if you load a document it has its
"document language" built in - it's
> >> >> the one stored in its default
paragraph style.
> >> > 
> >> > No, it's not... (Organize tab of the
style doesn't list language
> >> > setting)
> >> 
> >> Interesting. It *does* here.
> > 
> > Then you're not using the built-in default
template, but some other one
> > that already has the langauge set.
> 
> No, I'm using the built-in default template, admittedly
most of the time
> I'm using StarOffice. But my OOo 2.0 build (the only
one I could grab
> immediately) exactly did the same. It is a Sun build
(some of the kind
> you can download from OOo), don't know if that's what
you call a
> "vanilla" build.

/me is using linux - I use the german, Sun-provided build of
2.1 (680_m6, 9095)

> You seem to refer to the "Standard" style,
that's not what I am talking
> about. I was refering to the "Default style".
Here's this style from my
> styles.xml:

Getting the curve...
But then you cannot give the paragraph-style in the UI as an
argument...

> <style:default-style
style:family="paragraph">
> [...]
> </style:default-style>

Yes, in that style there is the language defined, but then
again this is
exactly the setting you choose when using Toolsptions.
This does not
depend on paragraph styles (at least what the rest of the
world thinks
of when talking about paragraph styles)

> > That doesn't count since that always shows values,
even when not
> > assigned in the style, but only inherited, either
from another inherited
> > style of from factory defaults, or from other
places in the document.
> 
> Yes, it's an inherited style. All paragraph styles
without an own
> language attribute inherit their language setting from
the default
> paragraph style. This value is shown in the dialog.
> 
> If you manually remove the language and country
settings from the
> default paragraph style you will not see a value for
the language in the
> dialog for editing the style as obviously in your
case.

No, I did not manually remove anything.

And even if I did, I would still see the value in the
font-tab.
But not in the organizer tab. (and that's back to the
topic)

> OOo also will
> take the document language from the metadata as a
fallback for the spell
> checker. But only then!

"only then" is the default case.

> If you don't see a value in your dialog you probably 
have a different
> default paragraph style. Correct?

Not correct. As written: I did not change anything. I don't
use a custom
default document template (and hence I'm not using a
modified default
paragraph style.

> As the default style IIRC is hard coded (have to check
that) I wonder
> how this can happen.
> 
> > I don't really distinguish between documentation
and implementation
> > here.
> > The wrong documentation (or behaviour) did cost me
at least two hours of
> > useless fiddling around.
> 
> We don't call something broken that never was correct.

I surely do. If you don't call something a bug when it works
/as
designed/, then I'm with you, but when you say: It doesn't
work, neved
did, so thus cannot be a bug, then we have different points
of view.

> Of course it's
> still a bug (and if you spent two hours finding it it
surely is an
> unfortunate one for you). You can accuse me of
nitpicking. 

Well, not in the mood for making fun about it right now.

> > It is not in the default paragraph-style, but in
the general section,
> > that also contains the default font chosen (since
in vanilla docs, this
> > is also not a property of the default paragraph
style).
> 
> What do you mean by "general section"? The
"default styles" section? Of
> course, that's what I was talking about all the time.
And my documents
> *do* have a language set there (see above) and it works
as described.

Yes, I mean the part you cited above.
The point was: Is there something like a document langauge.
I said yes,
you say no.

I argumented with the paragraph style not holding that info,
you said it
did (it is on your organize-tab). That apparently misguided
me to think
you were talking about the paragraph-style with name
"Default", the one you
can see in the Stylist, not of the default-style-section in
the document
that is not part of paragraph-styles at all.

> > For the spellcheck-functionality inside OOo, it
might look like a
> > property of the default paragraph style, but on
the xml-level it isn't.
> > (of course you can manually set the property in
the style)
> 
> As the OP asked for spellchecking I addressed that by
explaining how
> spellchecking works with languages. As in my documents
a language is set
> in the default paragraph style always (and I assumed
the same is true
> for his documents) changing the document language
property in the
> metadata wouldn't help at all - even if we didn't have
the bug that the
> language can't be set via API. You can try it by
hacking the meta.xml
> manually. OOo will ignore the language set there -
except if you also
> removed the language in the default style.

If you hard-code the language inside the paragraph-style
with name
"Default", you're doing something else than
changing the document
language (as done via Toolsptions) -
that's the point.

And even when both ways don't matter to the spell-checker
itself, it
is still two different things.

ciao
Christian
-- 
NP: Slipknot - Me Inside

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