RE: INFO

Hadriel, I don't get your example.

You would only get a KPML subscription for calls that
actually terminate
to 
the voicemail server. And I would imagine that MOST calls to
a voicemail
server
would actually use DTMF and therefore require a
subscription. 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stucker, Brian (RICH1:AR00) 
> Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 21:16
> To: Hadriel Kaplan; 'Eric Burger'; Audet, Francois
(SC100:3055)
> Cc: 'sip'
> Subject: RE: [Sip] INFO
> 
>  
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Hadriel Kaplan [mailto:HKaplanacmepacket.com]
> > Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 3:22 PM
> > To: 'Eric Burger'; Audet, Francois (SC100:3055)
> > Cc: 'sip'
> > Subject: RE: [Sip] INFO
> > 
> > But there are cases where the KPML model is vastly
greater 
> overhead.  
> > 
> > Consider a typical voicemail server.  For calls to
the voicemail 
> > server to retrieve messages, KPML is probably good
because you can 
> > define a digit map for the mailbox number and
password which would 
> > reduce overall message counts.  But for calls to
leave a voicemail 
> > (which I assume greatly outnumber those to
retrieve them, but you 
> > would know more about that than I), KPML has to
create a 
> subscription 
> > for every single call, just in case the caller
happens to 
> press some 
> > optional dtmf that the voicemail app supports. 
For each and every 
> > call, a subscription has to be routed and its
state saved 
> by stateful 
> > proxies along the path to the UAs, even though
only a small 
> fraction 
> > of the calls ever press a DTMF button.
> 
> Unless your voicemail users have a severe case of 
> obsessive-compulsive voicemailbox checking syndrome,
and the 
> users aren't checking their mailboxes when they have no
MWI 
> indication, the number of deposits is guaranteed to at
least 
> equal, and certainly exceed the number of retrievals
for any 
> non-trivial population of subscribers. Otherwise, you'd
only 
> need space for one voicemail in your mailbox. The fact
that I 
> doubt anyone has ever heard of such a ridiculous
voicemail 
> limit seems to confirm my assumptions.
> 
> Regards,
> Brian
> 


_______________________________________________
Sip mailing list  https://ww
w1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sip
This list is for NEW development of the core SIP Protocol
Use sip-implementorscs.columbia.edu for questions on current
sip
Use sippingietf.org for new developments on the application of
sip

But most calls to a voicemail server DON'T actually use
DTMF, I've been told
- since most calls to a vmail server are to leave messages. 
Calls to
retrieve voicemail do always use dtmf, but calls to leave
voicemail don't.
However calls to leave voicemail usually have the optional
ability for the
caller to send DTMF - for example pressing "*" and
then the passcode to
retrieve voicemail, or "0" to reach an attendant,
or some button to cancel
the recording, etc.  Only a fraction of those calls actually
end up with
someone pressing a dtmf button, but because you *could*
press dtmf, the
vmail server would have to KPML subscribe for all calls.

-hadriel

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Francois Audet [mailto:audetnortel.com]
> Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 12:59 PM
> To: Brian Stucker; Hadriel Kaplan; Eric Burger
> Cc: sip
> Subject: RE: [Sip] INFO
> 
> Hadriel, I don't get your example.
> 
> You would only get a KPML subscription for calls that
actually terminate
> to
> the voicemail server. And I would imagine that MOST
calls to a voicemail
> server
> would actually use DTMF and therefore require a
subscription.
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Stucker, Brian (RICH1:AR00)
> > Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 21:16
> > To: Hadriel Kaplan; 'Eric Burger'; Audet, Francois
(SC100:3055)
> > Cc: 'sip'
> > Subject: RE: [Sip] INFO
> >
> >
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Hadriel Kaplan [mailto:HKaplanacmepacket.com]
> > > Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 3:22 PM
> > > To: 'Eric Burger'; Audet, Francois
(SC100:3055)
> > > Cc: 'sip'
> > > Subject: RE: [Sip] INFO
> > >
> > > But there are cases where the KPML model is
vastly greater
> > overhead.
> > >
> > > Consider a typical voicemail server.  For
calls to the voicemail
> > > server to retrieve messages, KPML is probably
good because you can
> > > define a digit map for the mailbox number and
password which would
> > > reduce overall message counts.  But for calls
to leave a voicemail
> > > (which I assume greatly outnumber those to
retrieve them, but you
> > > would know more about that than I), KPML has
to create a
> > subscription
> > > for every single call, just in case the
caller happens to
> > press some
> > > optional dtmf that the voicemail app
supports.  For each and every
> > > call, a subscription has to be routed and its
state saved
> > by stateful
> > > proxies along the path to the UAs, even
though only a small
> > fraction
> > > of the calls ever press a DTMF button.
> >
> > Unless your voicemail users have a severe case of
> > obsessive-compulsive voicemailbox checking
syndrome, and the
> > users aren't checking their mailboxes when they
have no MWI
> > indication, the number of deposits is guaranteed
to at least
> > equal, and certainly exceed the number of
retrievals for any
> > non-trivial population of subscribers. Otherwise,
you'd only
> > need space for one voicemail in your mailbox. The
fact that I
> > doubt anyone has ever heard of such a ridiculous
voicemail
> > limit seems to confirm my assumptions.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Brian
> >



_______________________________________________
Sip mailing list  https://ww
w1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sip
This list is for NEW development of the core SIP Protocol
Use sip-implementorscs.columbia.edu for questions on current
sip
Use sippingietf.org for new developments on the application of
sip