pySVN as a remote backend

Howdy,

I was just wondering has any dev investigated possibility to
use pySVN 
as a backend for remote repositories?

It seems to be in pretty good shape nowadays.

Is there be some drawbacks/compatibility problems that
prevents using 
it? Or does it just need someone to write such a backend
plugin that 
uses pySVN?

-- 

Jani Tiainen

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Am 23.10.2007 um 10:27 schrieb Jani Tiainen:
> I was just wondering has any dev investigated
possibility to use pySVN
> as a backend for remote repositories?
>
> It seems to be in pretty good shape nowadays.
>
> Is there be some drawbacks/compatibility problems that
prevents using
> it? Or does it just need someone to write such a
backend plugin that
> uses pySVN?

The latter, as far as I know.

Cheers,
Chris
--
Christopher Lenz
   cmlenz at gmx.de
   http://www.cmlenz.net/


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Christopher Lenz kirjoitti:
> Am 23.10.2007 um 10:27 schrieb Jani Tiainen:
>> I was just wondering has any dev investigated
possibility to use pySVN
>> as a backend for remote repositories?
>>
>> It seems to be in pretty good shape nowadays.
>>
>> Is there be some drawbacks/compatibility problems
that prevents using
>> it? Or does it just need someone to write such a
backend plugin that
>> uses pySVN?
> 
> The latter, as far as I know.

Well, sounds like nice excercise to get back on Trac... 

-- 

Jani Tiainen


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2007/10/23, Jani Tiainen <redetingmail.com>:
> >> Is there be some drawbacks/compatibility
problems that prevents using
> >> it? Or does it just need someone to write such
a backend plugin that
> >> uses pySVN?
> >
> > The latter, as far as I know.
>
> Well, sounds like nice excercise to get back on Trac...


There is 'pysvn-plugin' I wrote before.
But I gave up that way... So it is not well maintained.

Thre reason I stopped is that PySVN (at least, the version
of pysvn on
that time) only have a WC level + alpha APIs and it does not
provide
small / low-level operations (unlike Subversion FS and RA
API does).
So I implemted with middle size of functions of PySVN to get
small
information required for Trac VC API.  As result, it was
slow.

# That is the reason I'd started trying to use RA layer of
swig python
# binding.

Here's a my old code.

  h
ttp://www.meadowy.org/~gotoh/projects/pysvn-plugin

It may help if you want to play or implementing:
I've forgot the implementation level of this code... sorry.


And also, RA version is here:

  http://www.meadowy.org/~gotoh/projects/remote-svn-plugin


RA version is not yet completed, but it would work, I
beleve.

-- 
Shun-ichi GOTO

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Shun-ichi GOTO kirjoitti:
> 2007/10/23, Jani Tiainen <redetingmail.com>:
>>>> Is there be some drawbacks/compatibility
problems that prevents using
>>>> it? Or does it just need someone to write
such a backend plugin that
>>>> uses pySVN?
>>> The latter, as far as I know.
>> Well, sounds like nice excercise to get back on
Trac... 
> 
> There is 'pysvn-plugin' I wrote before.
> But I gave up that way... So it is not well
maintained.
> 
> Thre reason I stopped is that PySVN (at least, the
version of pysvn on
> that time) only have a WC level + alpha APIs and it
does not provide
> small / low-level operations (unlike Subversion FS and
RA API does).
> So I implemted with middle size of functions of PySVN
to get small
> information required for Trac VC API.  As result, it
was slow.
> 
> # That is the reason I'd started trying to use RA layer
of swig python
> # binding.
> 
> Here's a my old code.
> 
>   h
ttp://www.meadowy.org/~gotoh/projects/pysvn-plugin
> 
> It may help if you want to play or implementing:
> I've forgot the implementation level of this code...
sorry.

Good to know that something exists. It seems that it's
rather old and I 
recall too that when I last time checked pySVN wasn't that
good shape 
than it is nowadays. I'll look forward to see if it's
"production" ready. 

> And also, RA version is here:
> 
>   http://www.meadowy.org/~gotoh/projects/remote-svn-plugin

> 
> RA version is not yet completed, but it would work, I
beleve.


That RA version I'm aware but never saw much discussion
about pySVN efforts.

-- 

Jani Tiainen

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> Is there be some drawbacks/compatibility problems that

> prevents using it? Or does it just need someone to
write such 
> a backend plugin that uses pySVN?

I wonder what the motivation would be for such a plugin. As
soon as
Subversion 1.5 sees the light of day the Python bindings
will provide
working RA repository support. Starting with Subversion 1.6
there will also
be the Python C-types bindings which provide access to
remote repositories
as well.

What would be the advantages of using pySVN?

Cheers,
Markus



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Markus Fuchs kirjoitti:
>> Is there be some drawbacks/compatibility problems
that 
>> prevents using it? Or does it just need someone to
write such 
>> a backend plugin that uses pySVN?
> 
> I wonder what the motivation would be for such a
plugin. As soon as
> Subversion 1.5 sees the light of day the Python
bindings will provide
> working RA repository support. Starting with Subversion
1.6 there will also
> be the Python C-types bindings which provide access to
remote repositories
> as well.

As long as 1.5 or 1.6 of SVN doesn't see a daylight... Have
exact dates? 

Thought so. If SVN team states that functionality is
available at 
tomorrow or on a next week or even month I wouldn't bother.
But since 
nobody really knows when 1.5 is out since it's only planned
to have 
fixed bindings. Nobody has stated that it will.

Motivation is that I need remote repository access today. Or
actually I 
needed it a year ago... (Which also applies to Trac 0.11


> What would be the advantages of using pySVN?

It seems to be currently working solution until something
better is 
provided.

-- 

Jani Tiainen



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On Oct 23, 1:27 am, Jani Tiainen <rede...gmail.com> wrote:
> I was just wondering has any dev investigated
possibility to use pySVN
> as a backend for remote repositories?
>
> It seems to be in pretty good shape nowadays.
>
> Is there be some drawbacks/compatibility problems that
prevents using
> it? Or does it just need someone to write such a
backend plugin that
> uses pySVN?

Speed is going to be a drawback since browsing files and
diffs will
require Trac to pull the entire file from the remote server
each time
and then transmit it back to the user.

Svnsync works to mirror the repository so that accesses are
local and
it only needs to do incremental updates of the mirror.

-- Matt


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Matt Good kirjoitti:
> On Oct 23, 1:27 am, Jani Tiainen <rede...gmail.com> wrote:
>> I was just wondering has any dev investigated
possibility to use pySVN
>> as a backend for remote repositories?
>>
>> It seems to be in pretty good shape nowadays.
>>
>> Is there be some drawbacks/compatibility problems
that prevents using
>> it? Or does it just need someone to write such a
backend plugin that
>> uses pySVN?
> 
> Speed is going to be a drawback since browsing files
and diffs will
> require Trac to pull the entire file from the remote
server each time
> and then transmit it back to the user.
> 
> Svnsync works to mirror the repository so that accesses
are local and
> it only needs to do incremental updates of the mirror.

Very good point. Wonder how it works with tortoissvn (or
plain svn) 
since now I only have HTTP access to our repositories
(except for trac 
that has been granted direct file access). Wouldn't it get
performace 
hit too from my HTTP access? (Or is it due the fact that
usually 
(tortoise)svn works with repository checkout that contains
base version 
so you can do certain stuff without hitting repository at
all...

Given a look, pySVN is not very good for Trac purposes (too
highlevel so 
to say). So I'll either manage without it or take a look on
that svn_ra 
stuff that already exists at some form.

Alas. Well, I know there exists more useful plugins to be
made...

-- 

Jani Tiainen



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On 10/24/07, Jani Tiainen <redetingmail.com> wrote:
>
> Matt Good kirjoitti:
> > On Oct 23, 1:27 am, Jani Tiainen <rede...gmail.com> wrote:
> >> I was just wondering has any dev investigated
possibility to use pySVN
> >> as a backend for remote repositories?
> >>
> >> It seems to be in pretty good shape nowadays.
> >>
> >> Is there be some drawbacks/compatibility
problems that prevents using
> >> it? Or does it just need someone to write such
a backend plugin that
> >> uses pySVN?
> >
> > Speed is going to be a drawback since browsing
files and diffs will
> > require Trac to pull the entire file from the
remote server each time
> > and then transmit it back to the user.
> >
> > Svnsync works to mirror the repository so that
accesses are local and
> > it only needs to do incremental updates of the
mirror.
>
> Very good point. Wonder how it works with tortoissvn
(or plain svn)
> since now I only have HTTP access to our repositories
(except for trac
> that has been granted direct file access).

Yes, all systems using direct file access are expected to be
faster at
URL-diffs than any of the other layers. Whether this is
actually
noticeable depends on the latency and transfer-speeds on the
network
accessing the repository.

Subversion libraries are designed to retrieve only 1
fulltext per
operation though: when diffing, 1 fulltext is retrieved and
the other
file is retrieved as a delta against the fulltext it just
got from the
server.


hth,

Erik.

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Hi Jani,

> But since nobody really knows when 1.5 is out since 
> it's only planned to have fixed bindings. Nobody 
> has stated that it will.

Well, this has been verified by Shun-ichi and me (cf. [1]
and [2])

> Motivation is that I need remote repository access
today. Or 
> actually I needed it a year ago... (Which also applies
to Trac 0.11 

Ok. My question about "why pySVN" refers to the
high demand of trac users
for remote repository access. That's why this should go into
core sooner or
later, IMHO. However, to minimize external dependecies, this
obviously means
that using the Subversion Python bindings are the first
choice in supporting
remote Subversion repositories. It'd also make perfectly
sense to pool our
strengths and create this plugin together, maybe taking
Shun-ichi's code as
the basis.
These are just my personal thoughts though.

> It seems to be currently working solution until
something 
> better is provided.

Until Subversion provides this functionality out of the box,
that is. 

Cheers,
Markus

[1]
http://www.meadowy.org/~gotoh/projec
ts/remote-svn-plugin/browser/tracremotes
vn/svn_ra.py#L109
[2] http://svn.collab.net/viewvc/svn?view=rev&revisi
on=22849



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On 10/24/07, Markus Fuchs <tracyeahware.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Jani,
>
> > But since nobody really knows when 1.5 is out
since
> > it's only planned to have fixed bindings. Nobody
> > has stated that it will.
>
> Well, this has been verified by Shun-ichi and me (cf.
[1] and [2])
>
> > Motivation is that I need remote repository access
today. Or
> > actually I needed it a year ago... (Which also
applies to Trac 0.11 
>
> Ok. My question about "why pySVN" refers to
the high demand of trac users
> for remote repository access. That's why this should go
into core sooner or
> later, IMHO. However, to minimize external dependecies,
this obviously means
> that using the Subversion Python bindings are the first
choice in supporting
> remote Subversion repositories. It'd also make
perfectly sense to pool our
> strengths and create this plugin together, maybe taking
Shun-ichi's code as
> the basis.
> These are just my personal thoughts though.
>
> > It seems to be currently working solution until
something
> > better is provided.
>
> Until Subversion provides this functionality out of the
box, that is. 

ViewVC has supported remote repositories for over 2,5 years
now, so
forgive my ignorance, but what functionality should
Subversion provide
"out of the box"?



bye,


Erik.

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Hi Erik, 

> ViewVC has supported remote repositories for over 2,5
years 
> now, so forgive my ignorance, but what functionality
should 
> Subversion provide "out of the box"?

Working Python bindings? The RA part (in the bindings!)
doesn't work AFAICT,
but there's hope that the bindings for the next release will
finally
properly support remote repositories.

Ok, it seems like I'm alone with my opinion here. I didn't
intend to prevent
somebody from fixing #493. Actually, I'm happy that someone
is coming back
to this topic.

Cheers,
Markus



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> > ViewVC has supported remote repositories for over
2,5 years
> > now, so forgive my ignorance, but what
functionality should
> > Subversion provide "out of the box"?
>
> Working Python bindings? The RA part (in the bindings!)
doesn't work AFAICT,
> but there's hope that the bindings for the next release
will finally
> properly support remote repositories.

Well, that's what my remark is about: ViewVC *is* a python
program
built on top of the bindings, but it does seem to work with
remote
access to repositories, including diffs etc. So, while I
believe you,
I can't match these two things. That's where my question
came from: if
the bindings are incomplete and don't provide the parts that
Trac
needs, maybe it's time to stipulate that on the Subversion
mailing
lists. Maybe someone can give that part some (extra)
attention?

> Ok, it seems like I'm alone with my opinion here. I
didn't intend to prevent
> somebody from fixing #493. Actually, I'm happy that
someone is coming back
> to this topic.

Thanks for your explanation.

bye,

Erik.

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