WX-NET (new developers and a SourceForge/project administrator)

I started using Mono about 2-3 years ago, and very heavily
in the last
year.
About one year ago, I needed to choose a GUI toolkit to
build a chat
(and other feature) application(s).

At that time Mono actually put wx-net in their list of GUI's
(its in
there still but not as prominent) along with gtk#, Cocoa#
and winforms.

At this time the mono winforms sucked, Cocoa# wasnt an
option, I wanted
something that deployed across linux/win32/macOSX, and gtk#
wasn't an
option because expecting a MacOSX user to put on a X11 env.
isn't a
given.

So wx-net made the logic choice, and so I used it.

I love the fact my application deploys on linux, win32 and
OSX without
any special kludges. It looks good on linux and win32, but
its a bit
weird on OSX, but none the less works.

I'd like to get involved with wx-net, but since my time is
totally book
for decades to come  I'd prefer
to consider donating some $$$ via
perhaps putting contracts out on www.getafreelancer.com for
example, and
get some inexpensive labour to work on it. GAF has work
pretty well for
me so far on other project where the work can be clearly
spec'd.

I'd hate to see wx-net dwindle when I think it has so much
promise, and
of course, I have used it, and want to continue to use it.

I have some questions re: wx-net development that i'd like
to just throw
out:

1) Currently wx-net is very usable, but there is of course
more features
that need to be added (full 2.6.1 compat.). Putting aside
catching
wx-net up to the latest wxwidgets release (if one just looks
at making
it fully 2.6.1 complete, 
in features and bug fixes), does one need to have good
knowledge of the
MACOSX Quartz and, good knowledge of gtk+2.0, and win32API's
(or a group
of people) to get to a polished 2.6.1 compat. wx-net ? OR is
it safe to
say that the work that needs to be done would work with the
existing
uses of Quartz/win32API/gtk+2.0 subsets of API's currently
used, and
that any other little issues here and there would be dealt
with in
managed code of c# ? (relates to (13) i guess)

2) Now assume getting to 2.7 wx-widgets compat., does this
need people
with great knowledge of Quartz/win32API/gtk+2.0 to get to
that level?

3) What are the biggest drawbacks (features) that 2.7 has,
that we are
not getting in 2.6.1 (via 0.7.2)?

4) What are the biggest remaining issues in 0.7.2 giving all
the
abilities of 2.6.1(wxwidgets)?

5) What does one have to have, by way of commercial/licensed
software (i
know on Linux that would be none) on win32 and OSX platform
to build the
distro files of a wx-net release?

6) How does Apples move to mac-tel change the ability/work
of getting a
wx-net version for now two platforms of OSX?

7) What is the typical pain involved with getting wx-net
working with
new OS releases of MACOSX, and MS win32(i.e. vista)?

8) Guessing with respect to time, how would one a allot that
resource to
the continuing wx-net, w.r.t.  (1) straight forward
engineering of
wrappers, (2) wx-net specifics (i.e. non-straightforward
engineering) of
wrappers and making things cohesive in wx-net, (3)
documentation, (4)
building releases for the linux/win32/osx platforms.
For example would it be (1) 60% (2) 30% (3) 5% (4) 5% ??

9) Is there any documented resources of the big challenges
still facing
wx-net, i.e. performance issues, coherence across the
platforms (i.e.
are all platforms capable of the same subset of wxwidgets
functionality)? (ther is mention of web site, not sure how
uptodate it
is).

10) Is everyone seriously involved with wx-net in the past
really moving
on? are they available for consultation to a minor extent?

11) Is the advent of Vista, and Jag (OSX next?) likely to
throw in much
pain to the wx-net effort? has anyone tried wx-net on a
vista beta?

12) What is the minimum number of man hours (i know this is
likely to be
a real rough guess) in a year, needed to keep wx-net
relatively alive?

13) What is the ratio breakdown to time needed in (A) wx-c
is a C++
library which exposes the wxWidgets API as a collection of
C# friendly
functions. 
VS.
(B)wx.NET is a .NET assembly written in C# which parallels
the wxWidgets
class hierarchy.

14) if resources are very low, is it an option to have
wx.net progress
on win32/linux and have OSX catch up later, of is there a
constitutional
clause  that
states wx-net should progress equally amongst all camps.


In some of my postings in the mono mail lists, I have
advertised my
happy use of wx-net, but I have a funny feeling that 
programmers are content with the cross platform gtk# GUI
(for
win32/linux), and few need that extra ability of an
effortless jump to
the MAC. 

So maybe I can contribute, I am not sure at this time. I do
know I will
have to make up my mind soon whether to continue development
of my
current projects in wx-net, or jump to gtk#, and hope that i
don't
regret not supporting the MAC side.

Hopefully others will show interest as well.

-tl





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Hi, just my quick answers to some of your questions:

> I started using Mono about 2-3 years ago, and very
heavily in the last
> year.
> About one year ago, I needed to choose a GUI toolkit to
build a chat
> (and other feature) application(s).
>
> At that time Mono actually put wx-net in their list of
GUI's (its in
> there still but not as prominent) along with gtk#,
Cocoa# and winforms.
>
> At this time the mono winforms sucked, Cocoa# wasnt an
option, I wanted
> something that deployed across linux/win32/macOSX, and
gtk# wasn't an
> option because expecting a MacOSX user to put on a X11
env. isn't a
> given.
>
> So wx-net made the logic choice, and so I used it.
>
> I love the fact my application deploys on linux, win32
and OSX without
> any special kludges. It looks good on linux and win32,
but its a bit
> weird on OSX, but none the less works.
>
> I'd like to get involved with wx-net, but since my time
is totally book
> for decades to come  I'd prefer
to consider donating some $$$ via
> perhaps putting contracts out on www.getafreelancer.com
for example, and
> get some inexpensive labour to work on it. GAF has work
pretty well for
> me so far on other project where the work can be
clearly spec'd.
>
> I'd hate to see wx-net dwindle when I think it has so
much promise, and
> of course, I have used it, and want to continue to use
it.
>
> I have some questions re: wx-net development that i'd
like to just throw
> out:
>
> 1) Currently wx-net is very usable, but there is of
course more features
> that need to be added (full 2.6.1 compat.). Putting
aside catching
> wx-net up to the latest wxwidgets release (if one just
looks at making
> it fully 2.6.1 complete,
> in features and bug fixes), does one need to have good
knowledge of the
> MACOSX Quartz and, good knowledge of gtk+2.0, and
win32API's (or a group
> of people) to get to a polished 2.6.1 compat. wx-net ?
OR is it safe to
> say that the work that needs to be done would work with
the existing
> uses of Quartz/win32API/gtk+2.0 subsets of API's
currently used, and
> that any other little issues here and there would be
dealt with in
> managed code of c# ? (relates to (13) i guess)

Basically, you don't have to know anything about
GTK/Quartz/..., it's
wxWidgets' job to hide all of it from you and expose a
uniform API for all
platforms. You only have to know some basics about wxWidgets
and .NET to
write a wrapper around wxWidgets (C++) -> that's what
wx.NET is 

> 2) Now assume getting to 2.7 wx-widgets compat., does
this need people
> with great knowledge of Quartz/win32API/gtk+2.0 to get
to that level?

The same applies, you only have to edit the wrapper to match
the new API.

> 3) What are the biggest drawbacks (features) that 2.7
has, that we are
> not getting in 2.6.1 (via 0.7.2)?

Didn't study 2.7's new features so I can't really tell :-(

> 4) What are the biggest remaining issues in 0.7.2
giving all the
> abilities of 2.6.1(wxwidgets)?

I need to find out but the main remaining tasks are on the
website.

> 5) What does one have to have, by way of
commercial/licensed software (i
> know on Linux that would be none) on win32 and OSX
platform to build the
> distro files of a wx-net release?
>
> 6) How does Apples move to mac-tel change the
ability/work of getting a
> wx-net version for now two platforms of OSX?
>
> 7) What is the typical pain involved with getting
wx-net working with
> new OS releases of MACOSX, and MS win32(i.e. vista)?

None. 
Well, not really but it's wxWidgets' problem 

> 8) Guessing with respect to time, how would one a allot
that resource to
> the continuing wx-net, w.r.t.  (1) straight forward
engineering of
> wrappers, (2) wx-net specifics (i.e.
non-straightforward engineering) of
> wrappers and making things cohesive in wx-net, (3)
documentation, (4)
> building releases for the linux/win32/osx platforms.
> For example would it be (1) 60% (2) 30% (3) 5% (4) 5%
??
>
> 9) Is there any documented resources of the big
challenges still facing
> wx-net, i.e. performance issues, coherence across the
platforms (i.e.
> are all platforms capable of the same subset of
wxwidgets
> functionality)? (ther is mention of web site, not sure
how uptodate it
> is).
>
> 10) Is everyone seriously involved with wx-net in the
past really moving
> on? are they available for consultation to a minor
extent?

The original developers have bee very helpful in answering
my questions,
so I think so... But we're all always short on time, you
know... :-(

> 11) Is the advent of Vista, and Jag (OSX next?) likely
to throw in much
> pain to the wx-net effort? has anyone tried wx-net on a
vista beta?
>
> 12) What is the minimum number of man hours (i know
this is likely to be
> a real rough guess) in a year, needed to keep wx-net
relatively alive?
>
> 13) What is the ratio breakdown to time needed in (A)
wx-c is a C++
> library which exposes the wxWidgets API as a collection
of C# friendly
> functions.
> VS.
> (B)wx.NET is a .NET assembly written in C# which
parallels the wxWidgets
> class hierarchy.
>
> 14) if resources are very low, is it an option to have
wx.net progress
> on win32/linux and have OSX catch up later, of is there
a constitutional
> clause  that
states wx-net should progress equally amongst all camps.
>
>
> In some of my postings in the mono mail lists, I have
advertised my
> happy use of wx-net, but I have a funny feeling that
> programmers are content with the cross platform gtk#
GUI (for
> win32/linux), and few need that extra ability of an
effortless jump to
> the MAC.
>
> So maybe I can contribute, I am not sure at this time.
I do know I will
> have to make up my mind soon whether to continue
development of my
> current projects in wx-net, or jump to gtk#, and hope
that i don't
> regret not supporting the MAC side.
>
> Hopefully others will show interest as well.
>
> -tl
>

Gotta return to work again, I hope to talk all your
questions later but i
believe other devs will answer as well...

C-ya
Radek Podgorny



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developers

You make it sound to easy 

Actaully its been some time since i deployed the apps i did
onto OSX,
win32, and linux,

I just revisited the linux install, and see the 

libwx_gtk2u_adv-2.6.so.0
libwx_gtk2u_adv-2.6.so.0.0.0
libwx_gtk2u_core-2.6.so
......
libwx_gtk2u_xrc-2.6.so
libwx_gtk2u_xrc-2.6.so.0
libwx_gtk2u_xrc-2.6.so.0.0.0


etc,

so there is the same for win32 (*.dll)  and MACOSX (what
ever it uses),

so its correct then you don't even have to develop on the
mac or windows
really?, except for the odd case of a bug, which would
trickle up to the
core wx-widget release most likely (on that platform)?

so it seems the only "tricks" are making a MAXOSX
install image and a
windows installed (which at this time is just a zip file  i
think).

So if this is the case ... that really all dev. can be done
on linux on
Mono?

So that clears up a bunch of my questions 

now just the feature completion, xw-2.7 release, and
time input questions I need some feed back on,
but so far looks pretty good, i was expecting an expert in
MAXOS and
win32 would have to be "on the team" to make this
work, but it doesn't
seem so.

-tl


On Tue, 2006-09-26 at 09:58 +0200, Radek Podgorny wrote:
> Hi, just my quick answers to some of your questions:
> 
> > I started using Mono about 2-3 years ago, and very
heavily in the last
> > year.
> > About one year ago, I needed to choose a GUI
toolkit to build a chat
> > (and other feature) application(s).
> >
> > At that time Mono actually put wx-net in their
list of GUI's (its in
> > there still but not as prominent) along with gtk#,
Cocoa# and winforms.
> >
> > At this time the mono winforms sucked, Cocoa#
wasnt an option, I wanted
> > something that deployed across linux/win32/macOSX,
and gtk# wasn't an
> > option because expecting a MacOSX user to put on a
X11 env. isn't a
> > given.
> >
> > So wx-net made the logic choice, and so I used it.
> >
> > I love the fact my application deploys on linux,
win32 and OSX without
> > any special kludges. It looks good on linux and
win32, but its a bit
> > weird on OSX, but none the less works.
> >
> > I'd like to get involved with wx-net, but since my
time is totally book
> > for decades to come  I'd prefer
to consider donating some $$$ via
> > perhaps putting contracts out on
www.getafreelancer.com for example, and
> > get some inexpensive labour to work on it. GAF has
work pretty well for
> > me so far on other project where the work can be
clearly spec'd.
> >
> > I'd hate to see wx-net dwindle when I think it has
so much promise, and
> > of course, I have used it, and want to continue to
use it.
> >
> > I have some questions re: wx-net development that
i'd like to just throw
> > out:
> >
> > 1) Currently wx-net is very usable, but there is
of course more features
> > that need to be added (full 2.6.1 compat.).
Putting aside catching
> > wx-net up to the latest wxwidgets release (if one
just looks at making
> > it fully 2.6.1 complete,
> > in features and bug fixes), does one need to have
good knowledge of the
> > MACOSX Quartz and, good knowledge of gtk+2.0, and
win32API's (or a group
> > of people) to get to a polished 2.6.1 compat.
wx-net ? OR is it safe to
> > say that the work that needs to be done would work
with the existing
> > uses of Quartz/win32API/gtk+2.0 subsets of API's
currently used, and
> > that any other little issues here and there would
be dealt with in
> > managed code of c# ? (relates to (13) i guess)
> 
> Basically, you don't have to know anything about
GTK/Quartz/..., it's
> wxWidgets' job to hide all of it from you and expose a
uniform API for all
> platforms. You only have to know some basics about
wxWidgets and .NET to
> write a wrapper around wxWidgets (C++) -> that's
what wx.NET is 
> 
> > 2) Now assume getting to 2.7 wx-widgets compat.,
does this need people
> > with great knowledge of Quartz/win32API/gtk+2.0 to
get to that level?
> 
> The same applies, you only have to edit the wrapper to
match the new API.
> 
> > 3) What are the biggest drawbacks (features) that
2.7 has, that we are
> > not getting in 2.6.1 (via 0.7.2)?
> 
> Didn't study 2.7's new features so I can't really tell
:-(
> 
> > 4) What are the biggest remaining issues in 0.7.2
giving all the
> > abilities of 2.6.1(wxwidgets)?
> 
> I need to find out but the main remaining tasks are on
the website.
> 
> > 5) What does one have to have, by way of
commercial/licensed software (i
> > know on Linux that would be none) on win32 and OSX
platform to build the
> > distro files of a wx-net release?
> >
> > 6) How does Apples move to mac-tel change the
ability/work of getting a
> > wx-net version for now two platforms of OSX?
> >
> > 7) What is the typical pain involved with getting
wx-net working with
> > new OS releases of MACOSX, and MS win32(i.e.
vista)?
> 
> None.  Well, not
really but it's wxWidgets' problem 
> 
> > 8) Guessing with respect to time, how would one a
allot that resource to
> > the continuing wx-net, w.r.t.  (1) straight
forward engineering of
> > wrappers, (2) wx-net specifics (i.e.
non-straightforward engineering) of
> > wrappers and making things cohesive in wx-net, (3)
documentation, (4)
> > building releases for the linux/win32/osx
platforms.
> > For example would it be (1) 60% (2) 30% (3) 5% (4)
5% ??
> >
> > 9) Is there any documented resources of the big
challenges still facing
> > wx-net, i.e. performance issues, coherence across
the platforms (i.e.
> > are all platforms capable of the same subset of
wxwidgets
> > functionality)? (ther is mention of web site, not
sure how uptodate it
> > is).
> >
> > 10) Is everyone seriously involved with wx-net in
the past really moving
> > on? are they available for consultation to a minor
extent?
> 
> The original developers have bee very helpful in
answering my questions,
> so I think so... But we're all always short on time,
you know... :-(
> 
> > 11) Is the advent of Vista, and Jag (OSX next?)
likely to throw in much
> > pain to the wx-net effort? has anyone tried wx-net
on a vista beta?
> >
> > 12) What is the minimum number of man hours (i
know this is likely to be
> > a real rough guess) in a year, needed to keep
wx-net relatively alive?
> >
> > 13) What is the ratio breakdown to time needed in
(A) wx-c is a C++
> > library which exposes the wxWidgets API as a
collection of C# friendly
> > functions.
> > VS.
> > (B)wx.NET is a .NET assembly written in C# which
parallels the wxWidgets
> > class hierarchy.
> >
> > 14) if resources are very low, is it an option to
have wx.net progress
> > on win32/linux and have OSX catch up later, of is
there a constitutional
> > clause  that
states wx-net should progress equally amongst all camps.
> >
> >
> > In some of my postings in the mono mail lists, I
have advertised my
> > happy use of wx-net, but I have a funny feeling
that
> > programmers are content with the cross platform
gtk# GUI (for
> > win32/linux), and few need that extra ability of
an effortless jump to
> > the MAC.
> >
> > So maybe I can contribute, I am not sure at this
time. I do know I will
> > have to make up my mind soon whether to continue
development of my
> > current projects in wx-net, or jump to gtk#, and
hope that i don't
> > regret not supporting the MAC side.
> >
> > Hopefully others will show interest as well.
> >
> > -tl
> >
> 
> Gotta return to work again, I hope to talk all your
questions later but i
> believe other devs will answer as well...
> 
> C-ya
> Radek Podgorny
> 
> 


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